logo

All times are UTC - 6 hours

Mark forums read


Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 17 posts ] 

Author Message
Offline
 Post subject: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 7:09 pm 
Third Jedi from the Left
Third Jedi from the Left
User avatar

Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2008 8:48 pm
Posts: 104
I'll preface this with a couple things, first MAndalorian's are both my favorite faction and the one i probably understand the best, and 2 I'm very unfamiliar at building for 150 points.

That being said, since 150 tends to be the official points range, paricular for big tournaments like gencon, i've been trying to figure out a good 150 point Mandalorians build.

One point I'm stuck on is the inclusion, or lack there of, of Boba Fett, Mercenary Commander. he'd be over a third of my points cost, and as i recall he is 60 mac damage a turn, but on the other hand the accurate shot he brings and gives can shoot around the likes of GOWK depending on the opponent's playstyle.

Thus, I'm stuck on whether what Boba brings is worth his points or would giving him up for more damage dealers be better? And if anyoen has any 150 poitn MAndalorian build's they like, I'd be interested as well.

_________________
~Umbra: Light is only a Shadow cast by the Darkness of the Stars.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2009 10:11 pm 
Black Sun Thug
Black Sun Thug
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 12:38 pm
Posts: 70
--Mando Commandos--
57 Boba Fett, Mercenary Commander
23 Mandalorian Captain
19 Mandalorian Scout
19 Mandalorian Scout
19 Mandalorian Scout
03 Mouse Droid
03 Ugnaught Demolishionist
03 Ugnaught Demolishionist
03 Ugnaught Demolishionist
(9 Activations)

_________________
Boba Fett, number one Bounty Hunter!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 5:36 am 
Droid Army Commander
Droid Army Commander
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 12:28 pm
Posts: 1636
I went similiar to Boba90's route:

--Bang--
57 Boba Fett, Mercenary Commander
19 Mandalorian Scout
18 Twi'lek Black Sun Vigo
17 Mandalorian Gunslinger
13 Czerka Scientist
13 Kel Dor Bounty Hunter
3 Mouse Droid
9 Ugnaught Demolitionist x3
(149pts. 10 activations)


This would give the Gunslinger GMA as well. The Kel Dor is there mostly to prevent strafing but could be taken out to add a Mando Commando (13) or Trooper (14 and gains Twin from the Czerka)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 7:42 am 
Master of the Order
Master of the Order
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 2:46 pm
Posts: 7960
Location: West Chester, OH (near Cincinnati)
Well, look at it this way. Compare Boba Merc Commander to Boba BH (which people have used at 150 points since he was released).

Both have:
Flight
Base 20 dmg
Accurate Shot
2 attacks and Mobile (Twin/Mobile for BH, GMA/Double for MC)
similar attack rating
Same HP
Same Def
Anti-swarm ability (Flamethrower for BH, Missles 30 for MC)


So, they're both pretty similar in a lot of ways. IMO, the only advantage BH really has is Evade and Disintegration. But if you're playing him well, Evade shouldn't really come into play all that often anyways. On the other side, MC has the advantage of Cunning Attack, which is a huge boost, as he can then use that +17 attack against Uniques or non-Uniques. I also think Double vs. Twin is actually an advantage, because it allows MC to knock scrubs out faster, especially if you get them with Cunning. MC's Penetration 10 is pretty situational, but against the possibility of seeing Luke's Snowspeeder, that's pretty significant. Boba only needs 3 hits with Cunning to kill the SS. The fact that MC has the AWESOME CE is just icing on the cake, IMO, especially since he costs 5 points less than BH to begin with.

At 150 points, I personally like the Czerka Scientist MUCH better than the Mando Captain. I know the Mouse Droid makes it much easier to run the Captain now, but 150 points is all about maximizing potential. And when you can do the same thing for your Scouts for 10 points less, AND give Jolt to Boba at the same time, that's a big bonus in my book.

So, for me, this build (which is really the same as it was right after KOTOR) is still my favorite:

Boba MC
Scout x3
Czerka
Human BG
Ugo/MD x4

You can drop the Human BG and run Wicket and another Ug/MD instead if you want, but the BG is helpful for protection against a Lancer or Yobuck, and gives your Czerka a bit of survivability.

I'm not convinced this squad can hold it's own against GOWK, but I haven't really played the matchup yet. The problem is the activations. A smart GOWK player will leave GOWK as your own target, if at all, and leave him till the very end to activate, forcing all your Scouts to shoot at something without the benefit of their Opportunist, which means they have to roll an 18 or higher to hit him. Even with Opportunist, they still have to roll a 14 or higher. Obviously, Boba's Accurate CE helps with this some, but in my experience, it's just too easy to stay completely out of LOS. And then, if Dash or Rex can get remotely close to the Scouts, you're in trouble, as they'll wipe them out pretty quick.

Mandos also end up struggling against other forms of Tempo control too, which has made them tough to run, since you end up depending on using a bunch of Ugos or Mouse Droids for activations, which are easily eliminated by Yobuck/Lancer. And other Tempo control squads will easily control gambit as well, out-activating you, then moving something cheap out at the end of a round. Pretty soon, you'll be forced to move Boba or your Scouts out into the gambit area, and then it starts to get dangerous.

_________________
-Aaron
Mand'alor
"You either die a hero, or you live to see yourself become the villain."
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 8:38 am 
Name Calling Internet Bully
Name Calling Internet Bully
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2007 10:10 pm
Posts: 6172
Location: Gurnee, IL
LoboStele wrote:
Boba MC
Scout x3
Czerka
Human BG
Ugo/MD x4


I was never convinced 3 scouts was a good way to go. I've always stuck with running two scouts and a gunslinger. Here's my build from KOTOR with some very slight updates.

--Boba and Mandos IE 150--
57 Boba Fett, Mercenary Commander
38 Mandalorian Scout x2
17 Mandalorian Gunslinger
14 Mandalorian Trooper
13 Czerka Scientist
5 Caamasi Noble
6 Ugnaught Demolitionist x2
(150pts. 9 activations)

The trooper can also be a Human BG and a Mouse droid, but I find this works well enough. I've got three cunning attackers, and the Mando trooper is a great detriment to opponents who overly focus on avoiding the Scouts and Boba. I use the Caamasi to maintain cover for the scouts and Trooper, and I rarely have to worry about my Czerka dying, so I've moved away from the BG with this build. Generally, by the time the Czerka can be attacked, I have either already won or lost.

Accurate cunning is still very tough in this game. And this Boba is better than Boba BH in my book, second only to Boba Merc.

_________________
Image

http://www.bloomilk.com/Squads/Search.aspx?UserID=29


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 8:54 am 
Master of the Order
Master of the Order
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 2:46 pm
Posts: 7960
Location: West Chester, OH (near Cincinnati)
billiv15 wrote:
I was never convinced 3 scouts was a good way to go. I've always stuck with running two scouts and a gunslinger. Here's my build from KOTOR with some very slight updates.


Excellent point. At 150 points, it's too easy to get out-activated, even if you're not facing a tempo control squad, so 3 Scouts probably is overkill. Definitely nice to mix things up a bit. I think if I was playing the Gunslinger though, I'd be doing whatever I could to work in a TBSV somewhere. Doing a TBSV instead of the Trooper/Noble wouldn't be too bad. Only have to lose 1 activation to do that. Don't know that 1 is really any better/worse than the other without some extensive testing. Just different options based on personal preferences.

_________________
-Aaron
Mand'alor
"You either die a hero, or you live to see yourself become the villain."
Image


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 9:00 am 
Name Calling Internet Bully
Name Calling Internet Bully
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2007 10:10 pm
Posts: 6172
Location: Gurnee, IL
LoboStele wrote:
billiv15 wrote:
I was never convinced 3 scouts was a good way to go. I've always stuck with running two scouts and a gunslinger. Here's my build from KOTOR with some very slight updates.


Excellent point. At 150 points, it's too easy to get out-activated, even if you're not facing a tempo control squad, so 3 Scouts probably is overkill. Definitely nice to mix things up a bit. I think if I was playing the Gunslinger though, I'd be doing whatever I could to work in a TBSV somewhere. Doing a TBSV instead of the Trooper/Noble wouldn't be too bad. Only have to lose 1 activation to do that. Don't know that 1 is really any better/worse than the other without some extensive testing. Just different options based on personal preferences.


You see, but the gunslinger already has evade, and the trooper has stealth. I like the ability to "bait" that I can get out of them. I can force people to make certain moves to get off that big attack on one of them, which of course sets them up for having to deal with Boba and the Scouts. You don't need an entire squad of GMAs honestly. The trooper gets quad, cunning, deadeye, accurate when you leave him alone, and that's what people seem to always miss when I play it. I don't know, this combo works for me pretty well. I've never had a big problem with using my Gunslinger properly.

_________________
Image

http://www.bloomilk.com/Squads/Search.aspx?UserID=29


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 1:52 pm 
Black Sun Thug
Black Sun Thug
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 12:38 pm
Posts: 70
Well with my build up top I never have any problem with getting off opportunist. I usually use Boba first and then the ugs. Usually I keep the ugs out of sight and just activate them. Well, I know I never have lost with my build and that's goinig against a GOWK squad.

_________________
Boba Fett, number one Bounty Hunter!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 2:09 pm 
Name Calling Internet Bully
Name Calling Internet Bully
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2007 10:10 pm
Posts: 6172
Location: Gurnee, IL
boba90 wrote:
Well with my build up top I never have any problem with getting off opportunist. I usually use Boba first and then the ugs. Usually I keep the ugs out of sight and just activate them. Well, I know I never have lost with my build and that's goinig against a GOWK squad.


Which in no way means it's an optimized build either. I'm personally very glad for you, but to be fair, you would still have had even better results by not using 3 scouts.

_________________
Image

http://www.bloomilk.com/Squads/Search.aspx?UserID=29


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 2:24 pm 
Black Sun Thug
Black Sun Thug
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 12:38 pm
Posts: 70
I'm just saying when I build a undefeated squad I keep it.

_________________
Boba Fett, number one Bounty Hunter!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 2:27 pm 
Name Calling Internet Bully
Name Calling Internet Bully
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2007 10:10 pm
Posts: 6172
Location: Gurnee, IL
boba90 wrote:
I'm just saying when I build a undefeated squad I keep it.


Fair enough, I tend to keep trying to make my builds better, even when I won with it. But if I am offering advice to others, I try to give them the best I can offer. That doesn't mean my advice is right, I just offer the best I can :)

_________________
Image

http://www.bloomilk.com/Squads/Search.aspx?UserID=29


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 2:37 pm 
Third Jedi from the Left
Third Jedi from the Left
User avatar

Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2008 8:48 pm
Posts: 104
Thanks very much everyone for the advice so far. I had never really thought of basline comparing Boba BH and Boba MC so that was an interteresting and effective approach

I also agree with using the czerca over the captain in 150, as much as i like the captain...however, I'm all for advice on keeping her alive.

As for the different builds, I played mandalorian's in a 200 tournament a few weeks ago and found my scouts having rough times with both San Hill and Ozzel tempo control squads, so mixing the cunning and oppurtunist looks good to me. And wow, I never would have looked at the Trooper before, that sounds painful if it get off its shots.

_________________
~Umbra: Light is only a Shadow cast by the Darkness of the Stars.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 2:38 pm 
Black Sun Thug
Black Sun Thug
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 12:38 pm
Posts: 70
Thta's cool billiv. No problem. 8-)

_________________
Boba Fett, number one Bounty Hunter!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 2:40 pm 
Name Calling Internet Bully
Name Calling Internet Bully
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 01, 2007 10:10 pm
Posts: 6172
Location: Gurnee, IL
boba90 wrote:
Thta's cool billiv. No problem. 8-)


Coolio, just didn't want you to think I was picking on you or anything. The more and varied advice we give people, the more information they have to make a better decision, so it's totally worth the discussion :)

_________________
Image

http://www.bloomilk.com/Squads/Search.aspx?UserID=29


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 2:43 pm 
Black Sun Thug
Black Sun Thug
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 12:38 pm
Posts: 70
Cool. How do you get the boba90 wrote thing I can't figure it out.

_________________
Boba Fett, number one Bounty Hunter!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 2:55 pm 
Third Jedi from the Left
Third Jedi from the Left
User avatar

Joined: Tue Sep 30, 2008 8:48 pm
Posts: 104
boba90 wrote:
Cool. How do you get the boba90 wrote thing I can't figure it out.



Bottom right corner of the post you want to reference, there is a qoute button. Click that you go to the reply screen with their name and post qouted as such.

_________________
~Umbra: Light is only a Shadow cast by the Darkness of the Stars.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  

Offline
 Post subject: Re: Importance of Accurate Shot
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 3:00 pm 
Black Sun Thug
Black Sun Thug
User avatar

Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2008 12:38 pm
Posts: 70
Oh I always wondered what that quote button was. thanx.

_________________
Boba Fett, number one Bounty Hunter!!!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 17 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 6 hours

Mark forums read

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
Jedi Knights style by Scott Stubblefield