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 Post subject: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Feb 27, 2012 8:59 am 
Black Sun Thug
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Well when i first had gotten introduced to SWM's i fell in love with General Whorm Loathsome and thought he was just amazing and actually shunned General Greivous Droid Army Commander. i thought god he is amazing 20 points and gives twin awesome and then throw BDO in as well and give the plus four, yeah then reallity hit me a couple weeks ago when playing this squad i had forgotten to load the mouse droids in the main squad, i thought "O well just throw them in to reserves you'll be fine" NOPE not fine due to the lack of time that i had i was unable to fully comprehend some of the new V-set and forgot about Tyber Zann. I only have 5 mouse droids in my collection however, i was playing with gha nackt so brought them in for 2 apeice and something else as well thought o i will be good then Hannahcannon said "O bribary i will take those" and yes the match was still awesome with him only winning by a point or two but forgetting to main them neutered the strategy. So i revisited ,y shunned friend GGDAC and re-evaluated him and have been messing with them a little and this is what i have came up with.

GGDAC
Darth Sidious
IG Lancer Droid
IG-86 Assassin droid x2
R7-astromech
San Hill
mouse droids x3-5
BDO

just so you all know im doing this off of memory currently i am sitting in bed sick and dont have the squad arround, so sorry for not have the accurate list of what was played.yeah trying the mouse droid wall built in really did help and with only one activation i was confirmed to be able to use the opportunist on the main target. he was playing an OR variant that had Master thon, MAster Kavar, Nomi sunrider i think Vander, and some ugnaughts as well the match was great however there was some sloppy playing due to the lack of time but turned out really good so input is appreciated as always thanks once again

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 11:06 am 
Black Sun Thug
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instead of posting an entire new thread about the same squad but with a slight difference i will just keep it on the same and hopefully people will be able to help with some input.

last night me and audrisampson played a couple matches in preparation for regionals and one of the matches that we played was this squad that i beleive that i will take to regionals and beleive that i found the map as well.

Poggle-86
map: Jabbas palace

GGDAC
Darth sidious
san hill
poggle the lesser
BDO
lancer
ig 86 assassin droid
geonosian drones x 7
r7
uggy x3


i personally like this squad a lot however the issue of only having lancer and 86 as you main attackers and then also ggdac as well makes me a little nervous especially since typically atleast when i play it lancer really doesnt stay around for more than the first 2 rounds however usually does do a nice bit of damage.

personnaly this squad is very strong against most match ups, however it does have some major weaknesses i mean bastilla squads do hurt a ton and a half however as i seen last night it is able to deal with them as long as i dont run head on into it thinking well im done as soon as i see bastilla. the other issue is vong, however the only playtest that i have actually been able to play against vong is bomb, however i think that i may be able to deal with them possibly but only if i am able to send the l;ancer directly for nom. as for any other vong our areas vong squad is predominatly bombs so we dont see much else besides them.

but i am open for opinions and recomendations as well

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 1:19 pm 
Imperial Dignitaries
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I'd suggest dropping GGDAC, since he's only boosting two figs, one of which will last only 1-2 rounds (as you already know). I think you'd do better to use Whorm if you want Twin for your IG-86s (you can add more of them this way), or else ignore the Twin altogether and go with a solid beatstick such as Assaj Separatist Assassin (43pts).

Either way, Poggle Bombs will cause big trouble for many squads, and the Sidious-Lancer combo works well with Bombs because you can Pawn the bombs after the lancer is dead, so that Sidious is still very effective.

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 1:32 pm 
Black Sun Thug
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I had run the whorm variant but the issue is I had was having to run the mouse Droids in a formation that would have to be like a grid. I never hand the best luck with that variation. It was always close but never what I needed to finish the job. But I will run some numbers and see what I can do and play test both ways

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 2:12 pm 
Black Sun Thug
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this is the list that i came up with now with the whorm build i kinda like it.


General Whorm Loathsome – 20
San Hill – 10
Poggle the Lesser – 9
Darth Sidious – 36
Gha Nachkt – 12
Lancer droid – 31
Ig-86 assassin droid – 17-x2
Mouse droids – 3x5
Battle Droid Officer -9
R7 astromech droid – 8
Uggy- 3x3
Geonosian drones -3x8

i like this idea i get more activations, more poggles, and more assassin droids.

i also have been pndering in regards to putting muun tactics broker in this kind of build, using them to activate the bombs by sacking them and also getting the first initiative of the turn could be pretty good. but not sure what i would take out.

Also the other issue is i had general whorm loathsome up untill about 72 hours ago when i traded it to hannah cannon, i bet if i ask real nicley i may be able to borrow it if he is not using it in anything.

the other thought that i had been pndering which i keep telling my self no but cant help but to revisit the thought is to drop the lancer and maybe 1 poggle and add 2 more assassin droids, but i am not sure on that one either cause the lancer is really pretty good and a great movement breaker and with it i think that i may stand a chance against bastilla squads by getting to her. unlike with out it i dont really stand much of a chance for getting to her to shut her down.

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Sun Mar 11, 2012 2:21 pm 
Black Sun Thug
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Alright so let us try this again, I just made a real lengthy reply and was typed out real nice and then hit the send button and lost my damn internet connection and lost my reply, so lets try it on Microsoft word and hope my computer doesn’t crash stupid POS.

So this is the list that I have came up with using Whorm:
General Whorm Loathsome – 20
San Hill – 10
Poggle the Lesser – 9
Darth Sidious – 36
Gha Nachkt – 12
Lancer droid – 31
Ig-86 assassin droid – 17-x2
Mouse droids – 3x5
Battle Droid Officer -9
R7 astromech droid – 8
Uggy- 3x3
Geonosian drones -3x8
I really like this build quite a bit because you get more activations, more poggles, and more assassin droids so all and all a better build. Unfortunately I am not guaranteed that I am going to have twin on some of your figures in the far back but it is worth the sacrifice possibly.
The first issue with this squad was up to about 72 hours ago I had general whorm loathsome in my collection however I just traded it off to my buddy Hannahcannon. So maybe if I ask real nicely I may be able to borrow it unless he is using it.
The second question I have is that I had been thinking about putting muun tactics broker in this squad or other variants, in order to use them for another trigger to blow up my bombs and of course to win initiative. However I am unsure of what I would take out for it.
Finally another question that I have been pondering but keep telling myself no but cant help revisiting this thought, what if I took out lancer and replace it with to assassin droids, I know that I would have to drop probably a drone or something but would it be worth it?

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:35 am 
Dark Lord of the Sith
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i would try and work in Lobot and then play MTB or just play the MTB in the base and kill it off vs san hill turn one and keep it around vs NTMTO since you can kill off han or fett at some point in the game.

You pretty much can keep the lancer around for along time with the MTB.
The MTB can let you get around pieces you dont wont to attack since you have 72 squares of movement vs hoping to win init.

Keep the lancer and work in lobot/MTB


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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 11:05 am 
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This is very similar to what Tim ran last year at gen con and I think lobot is a neccesity in this build.

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 11:15 am 
Third Jedi from the Left
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He might be a bit hesitant to rely on Lobot because of me. We've seen a lot less Lobot around here the past few weeks since I started playing Tyber Zann in a few of my squads, and he took the hardest hit from zann after I stole all of his mouse droids in one match.


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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 11:29 am 
Dark Lord of the Sith
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so he brings in another ig droid problem solved.

Locally I would just bring in the MTB into the base squad.


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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 12:20 pm 
Black Sun Thug
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I think I would be able to fit mtb in no problem however Lobot would be another story cause mtb and Lobot are 37 points as a whole

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:13 pm 
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Lobot would solve some of the other problems that other squads might give him, if he runs into zann no problem, like johnny said, just bring in another Ig. I think lobot does way to much for the squad to just ignore him. With me playing Tim a lot I've seen a lot of this kind of squad and with the importance of lobot to this squad, tyber zann is no excuse not to run him.

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:28 pm 
Master of the Order
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SvenBlackSunVigo wrote:
I think I would be able to fit mtb in no problem however Lobot would be another story cause mtb and Lobot are 37 points as a whole


Never EVER bring in an MTB in the base squad.

What happens if you face San Hill? Whoops.

No no no - You MUST only ever bring in an MTB through reinforcements or reserves.

Only if you already have enough fodder to burn (6 uggs/mice/drones/workers minimum), and only if your opponent is not playing San, or a squad that can quickly kill all your sacrificial fodder (ie Yodabuck, lancer, etc.)

Tyber Zann doesn't negate Lobot. You just have to not make the mistake of bringing in something that is bribable (or worth them bribing). If they have low activations, bring in an MTB and watch them kill their own squad if they steal him. Then just laugh. If they have a team that can benefit from having an MTB and they have Tyber, DON'T bring in an MTB - they'll just steal yours.

The only way (IMO) an MTB really works - is if you have a squad designed for it (lots of fodder built in and/or an "exit strategy"), and then bring in an MTB through (usually) Lobot - IF (and only if) it's the right move after you see your opponents squad.

PS - an "exit strategy" is a way to kill the MTB when you no longer want him. Having any character with self destruct next to the MTB is usually the way to go. Have the MTB kill that character and it kills the MTB. Sidious can also pawn him.

MTBs are awesome, but you have to use them with great care. They have won me multiple regional championships, but you have to know when to use them.


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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 2:49 pm 
Black Sun Thug
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Well we are back to the issue of square one what to take our for muun tactics broker

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 3:39 pm 
Black Sun Thug
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I like the idea of Lobot however I would have to drop gha, the three uggys,r7, two m mouse, and two drones. I understand Lobot is good but really that good, I don't think I would be able and the thing with mtb wouldn't bee that bad especially with right disposable Drones and other things buy i'm not sure

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 3:56 pm 
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You drop an Ig, 2 drones and 2 uggies. Is lobot really that good? Yes, espicially in a squad like this. 1 Ig should be fine and if not you can bring one in for free if your playing against zann. I don't play lancer, just not my style, but I consider Tim to be one of, and if not, the best lancer player in the country, his regional titles speak for themselves. If I was ever going to play lancer or work on a lancer build, Tim is the first guy I would contact to look it over and help with it. 2 out of his 5 regional titles has been lancer squads against my vong bombs in the finals. What is your plan for vong bombs without lobot. If it wasn't for lobot then those 2 regional titles would belong to me. And yes I had lobot in my vong squad and he was a nessecity in that squad as well. Long story short, if you are going to listen to anybody about lancer squad advice, then listen to Tim, he knows what he's talking about.

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 4:49 pm 
Black Sun Thug
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Well I appreciate the help guys, sorry if I came off abrasive by any means i'm not familiar with screen names or peoples specialties in squad so I defiantly like the in put on this next question would out be better to just go ig r7 and one drone instead of loosing two drones and two uggys or should I go two override units

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 7:59 pm 
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SvenBlackSunVigo wrote:
Well I appreciate the help guys, sorry if I came off abrasive by any means i'm not familiar with screen names or peoples specialties in squad so I defiantly like the in put on this next question would out be better to just go ig r7 and one drone instead of loosing two drones and two uggys or should I go two override units


That is more of a preference thing, I know Tim, and me personally like the double override.
1 reason being that if you need to bring in uggies there cheaper than an r7 and more free activations. Also if you have double override and can't bring in a mtb (if your playing san or zann). You outactivate, open the door, take your shots or set up for next round, then lock the the door so you don't have to worry about if you lose init. I'm just here to help. Tim (TimmerB 123) and I (my name is Jake) will be in danville on Sunday for some gaming if your joining us then we can talk then. Just for some background on us, Tim has the more regional wins than anybody (5) and is extremely good at playing the lancer, 2 of his wins both times beating me in the finals were with lancer squads with whorm. And in 2010 (I think) he took a third at the Chicago regional also beating me for third with a lancer squad. I love the vong and have been told by a couple people that I make very good vong squads (and that was before they became playable after v-set 1). I however am not a hall of famer like Tim is, hopefully that will change. Tim is the creator of Tile wars, and I am the creator of royal rumble (which we will be playing on Sunday when we're up there so hopefully you can join us). Probably should have posted all this in a different thread as to not take up your squad critique thread with this. All is good, Tim and I are just here to help ask us anything as we are both veterans of the game.

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 8:55 pm 
Black Sun Thug
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Much appreciated for the help and the bio, i'm really glad that I have someone who had played the squad competitively giving me help with it add well.as for Sunday I will have to see what the wife says those are typically herand my day to spend some quality time togetherbut I will see

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 Post subject: Re: Yet another seppy squad
PostPosted: Mon Mar 12, 2012 9:09 pm 
Imperial Dignitaries
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Yes, when Tim talks about either the Lancer or the MTB, he is right.

He and Jason Kiernan (urbanjedi) are clearly the best 2 lancer players in the history of the game, though Jason has usually used GGDAC, while Tim has usually used Whorm.

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