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 Post subject: Re: sometimes the plant can become potbound..
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:04 am 
Death Star Designers
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I think the battle of theed set is the miniatures you are looking for... much like many of the smaller skirmish sets wizards put out they make an easy way to teach people the game. I still use the one with gowk to introduce new people i know. it's simple and has 3 pieces.

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 Post subject: Re: sometimes the plant can become potbound..
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 8:24 am 
Sith Apprentice
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With no new figures and old ones becoming increasingly difficult to find, I would suggest creating a set of tokens for each Vset character (perhaps multiples of the Non-Uniques) and having them along with a printed set of DOTF available to hand out for when those interested observers ask about the game. While tokens aren't as cool as the minis, it's certainly a valid option that just might help you in your quest.


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 Post subject: Re: sometimes the plant can become potbound..
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 9:23 am 
Death Star Designers
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Do you mean something like these:


You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

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 Post subject: Re: sometimes the plant can become potbound..
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 9:38 am 
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jacko wrote:
please note, I'm not putting this up to start a fight, It's just an observation of how "growing the game" might not work.

I am looking for solutions, I am not passing any critism or judgekment anywhere.

(jacko sticks his head out of the bunker)

I'm not sure that the virtual sets "grow" the game.
(jacko ducks and waits for pause in explosions. and waits, and waits)

we have made the game very exclusive. I admit, I am in the middle of nowhere gaming wise. Our irregular group counts 3, thats 3. All of us being in the same room at the same time would be lucky to be once a year.

However we have had people say, "what are you guys playing?....looks cool...where do you get the figures?...what do you mean they don't make them anymore?...Download and print them out without the figures?... nah I don't need to get into that."

(jacko presents a white flag)

now I realise that other people have much bigger groups and are more well equipped than us, but we can't find anyone interested in joining us for love or money (or beers for that matter).

I am not craping on anything that the community has done or is doing, I just think that as we look to the future we make sure that we have not closed the door on late comers who could be really important to our game.

I'm all ready to hear that I am wrong. Does anyone know someone whose first set was DotF?


I've read this post 7 times and I just don't get it. How do V-sets "make the game exclusive?" How does it not take new players into account? The cards are free, courtesy of the generosity and support of the entire existing community. Even if someone can't get a printed set, they can download them right off the website. Vassal is free. The miniatures are easily purchased off sponsor websites, several of whom have banners running across the top of the pages on this site.

Shall we also give away miniatures to new players? And where do we procure these to do that? Even if we had the means to create new plastic figures, doing so would most certainly move us from legal gray area to clear copyright violation.

For all the claims and hypotheses you posit in this post, nothing about it suggest there is something we should be doing that we're not. Would you rather we didn't have the V-sets at all? How does that 'grow the game" or "help new players?" Without the V-sets, it's just another dead WotC game that will quickly be forgotten.

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 Post subject: Re: sometimes the plant can become potbound..
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 10:51 am 
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Azavander wrote:
Do you mean something like these:


That is brilliant. Obviously not as good as new minis, but I wouldn't mind a future where we all have V-sets using token pieces like that. Solves both the mini supply issue (tournament legal token mice?), plus you can create any kind of token, even characters that have no good stand-in mini. Kudos!


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 Post subject: Re: sometimes the plant can become potbound..
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 1:46 pm 
Sith Apprentice
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Azavander wrote:
Do you mean something like these:


Those are excellent, another token option is standing paper figures, I've seen some before, but don't have a link to any atm.


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 Post subject: Re: sometimes the plant can become potbound..
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:01 pm 
Death Star Designers
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Something like that could be done very easily, I did those in about 5 minutes (which is odvious due to some missing gaps) but the current rules do not allow that for competitive play, so there would have to be a change, though for house rules I would imagine that would be fine, and I may do something like that for RR for some of the figs we do not have as a group.

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 Post subject: Re: sometimes the plant can become potbound..
PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2011 7:44 pm 
Jedi Battlemaster
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@jacko,

If your playgroups wants a few copies of R&R (ie, enough for all the players, plus one or two give to new or interested people) you don't have to donate or pay or shell out, or whatever, just request a set in the pointman forum.

Something I've been working towards is completing a second set of SWM, so I have enough for anyone to come and play whatever they want.

If you can say "They're hard to get, but I've got them all/lots/many/some and I'm happy to let you use them if you want to learn."

Plus there are a ton of other resources to help introduce them to the game (bloomilk, SWMGamers, miniverse, Holocron, Minimanager, etc)

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 Post subject: Re: sometimes the plant can become potbound..
PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 6:07 am 
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Azavander wrote:
Something like that could be done very easily, I did those in about 5 minutes (which is odvious due to some missing gaps) but the current rules do not allow that for competitive play, so there would have to be a change, though for house rules I would imagine that would be fine, and I may do something like that for RR for some of the figs we do not have as a group.


While currently not valid for tournament play (I do feel this is something they should consider allowing most likely restricted to just Vset figures though). The point of having tokens and giving them to another player is to help grow the game, if that player then decides to get more competitive they certainly should look at purchasing the official WOTC figures they want/need, but if they just want to have fun then something like that just might be the answer to the OPs concern.


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 Post subject: Re: sometimes the plant can become potbound..
PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 9:20 am 
Name Calling Internet Bully
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Lord_Ball wrote:
Azavander wrote:
Something like that could be done very easily, I did those in about 5 minutes (which is odvious due to some missing gaps) but the current rules do not allow that for competitive play, so there would have to be a change, though for house rules I would imagine that would be fine, and I may do something like that for RR for some of the figs we do not have as a group.


While currently not valid for tournament play (I do feel this is something they should consider allowing most likely restricted to just Vset figures though). The point of having tokens and giving them to another player is to help grow the game, if that player then decides to get more competitive they certainly should look at purchasing the official WOTC figures they want/need, but if they just want to have fun then something like that just might be the answer to the OPs concern.


You'd only need figures for regionals and Gencon events. If a new player is going to play in one of these, they should borrow figures, that's a reasonable expectation. But for any other local play, go to town. I think it's a cool idea. If someone wants to make all of these, I'd be happy to put up a PDF on the download page for people to print them out.

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 Post subject: Re: sometimes the plant can become potbound..
PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 4:52 pm 
Unnamed Wookiee
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billiv15 wrote:
Lord_Ball wrote:
Azavander wrote:
Something like that could be done very easily, I did those in about 5 minutes (which is odvious due to some missing gaps) but the current rules do not allow that for competitive play, so there would have to be a change, though for house rules I would imagine that would be fine, and I may do something like that for RR for some of the figs we do not have as a group.


While currently not valid for tournament play (I do feel this is something they should consider allowing most likely restricted to just Vset figures though). The point of having tokens and giving them to another player is to help grow the game, if that player then decides to get more competitive they certainly should look at purchasing the official WOTC figures they want/need, but if they just want to have fun then something like that just might be the answer to the OPs concern.


You'd only need figures for regionals and Gencon events. If a new player is going to play in one of these, they should borrow figures, that's a reasonable expectation. But for any other local play, go to town. I think it's a cool idea. If someone wants to make all of these, I'd be happy to put up a PDF on the download page for people to print them out.




yesz please to the pdf tokens on the download, this is want I was after. thank you.

insulting people wont bring them to the game, but this will.

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 Post subject: Re: sometimes the plant can become potbound..
PostPosted: Wed Jun 22, 2011 5:04 pm 
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obikenobi1 wrote:
Echo wrote:


Also keep in mind that we aren't the only game to do this, and what we are doing is a tried and true strategy. There is an Atlanta gaming group for both the Star Wars CCG and the Star Trek CCG, both of which gain new players (the Star Trek one in particular has had a bit of a growth spurt lately), and both games have been out of print for years and are currently only being kept alive by virtual sets, just like ours.



:shock:

You wouldn't happen to know if there are any Star Trek and Star Wars CCG gamers in Minnesota would you? I thought I was of a dying breed.... :cry: But now you have given me hope! :D Thank you sir! I had no idea they were continuing to make Star Trek CCG virtual sets. Time to revamp my recruitment techniques. :)


I don't actually play the game (I'd like to, just haven't had the time to really get into it), but the info for the Star Trek virtual sets is at http://www.trekcc.org/. They call themselves the "Continuing Committee". It's the tail end of their Regional Season also, but it looks like there was one in Coon Rapids, MN back in April, so I'd assume there are some players there. Also appears that there was one in Fargo, ND and Sioux Falls, SD.

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 Post subject: Re: sometimes the plant can become potbound..
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2011 10:46 am 
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MN used to be the last great bastion of SWCCG. It might've changed, but I have a hard time seeing it die completely.

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 Post subject: Re: sometimes the plant can become potbound..
PostPosted: Thu Jun 23, 2011 12:02 pm 
Droid Army Commander
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Echo wrote:
obikenobi1 wrote:
Echo wrote:


Also keep in mind that we aren't the only game to do this, and what we are doing is a tried and true strategy. There is an Atlanta gaming group for both the Star Wars CCG and the Star Trek CCG, both of which gain new players (the Star Trek one in particular has had a bit of a growth spurt lately), and both games have been out of print for years and are currently only being kept alive by virtual sets, just like ours.



:shock:

You wouldn't happen to know if there are any Star Trek and Star Wars CCG gamers in Minnesota would you? I thought I was of a dying breed.... :cry: But now you have given me hope! :D Thank you sir! I had no idea they were continuing to make Star Trek CCG virtual sets. Time to revamp my recruitment techniques. :)




I don't actually play the game (I'd like to, just haven't had the time to really get into it), but the info for the Star Trek virtual sets is at http://www.trekcc.org/. They call themselves the "Continuing Committee". It's the tail end of their Regional Season also, but it looks like there was one in Coon Rapids, MN back in April, so I'd assume there are some players there. Also appears that there was one in Fargo, ND and Sioux Falls, SD.


Thanks for the info. I'm going to defineltly look into it. I was really suprised to see a lot of Star Wars CCG cards in my FLGS. A couple of my friends were interested in getting into Star Wars and Star trek CCG, so hopefully we can get a group set up here. These two card games are some of the best ever made and I'm glad to see that the fans are still continuing the sets.

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