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 Post subject: Speedy Cannon - Hoth Base
PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 10:20 am 
Name Calling Internet Bully
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With the Echo base themed squads being en vogue, I thought I should post my favorite.

Han Scoundrel
Princess Leia
R2
Luke's Snowspeeder
Human BG
Obi FS
Ugo X4

10 acts, 150pts.

What you will notice are a slightly low number of acts for me at 150, and no MTB potencial, which you might think is a mistake, but its intentional. I also have no counter to opposing MTB squads, but again, that is intentional.

The 10 activations means I can protect the ones I need to from an early strike, which makes the opposing MTB very limited and dangerous for the opponent. While they might be tempted to take a first round override shot on me, I likely get to kill their override piece and their shooter. This has damage output going first with Han, or later with the Snow, and Leia can pump both. I really don't care about init control with this, as my defensive powers, DR and Mettle/Evade are enough to keep the big guns alive in most cases, and the Snow can run the melee interference if needed for Han late.

Offensively, I have one piece who will move slowly, in Han, and one that can move all over the place, giving me the option for deep strikes when needed. The issue with the MTB squads is that Echo Outpost may in fact be their best counter, especially with certain factions who don't have access to NTMTOs or San Hill. For example, Mandos are excellent against MTB squads on this map if they include Boba MC, if Boba sets up second. You also face the issue of, "Do I hide my sacrifices or do I hide my dmg pieces?" Its a tough call and either way, this map can hurt those MTB builds quickly. Lobot is a tremendous liability on this map. You cannot use his override without expecting him to die in return. And even if you try to hide him, its about 2 turns till he is dead anyways. That's a huge point differential, and another reason the MTB engine faces issues on this map.

On maps other than Hoth base, I could have more trouble, but certainly I am not out of it either. This squad can also deal well with Vong, which is a plus.

And finally, its pretty much a themed build, with the exception of the ugos, but who's counting them anyways :)

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 Post subject: Re: Speedy Cannon - Hoth Base
PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 12:19 pm 
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This is basically the same as the Han Speeder squad that somebody (I believe possibly Fingersandteeth) posted a few weeks back, with the Human BG and an Ugo swapped out for Dodonna and the Caamasi. The Human BG is definitely a good choice. You'll have to watch your set up still against players with Missles though, as even with the BG, you might still lose a key piece or two. Will have to screen well with an Ugnaught. The Human BG's 40 hp also helps with that, since even if you do take a Missle 30 hit, he'd still have 10 left, in order to soak up a big hit somewhere else.

I'm wondering how this would fare against a San Hill build with the MTB, though as you pointed out, you're going to lose either San, the MTB, or a couple pieces of fodder right off the bat. So while the lack of Dodonna concerns me a small amount, I'm thinking it may not be that bad of a problem.

Lack of init control doesn't bug me one bit. I played the Han Speeder squad two weeks ago for our 150 point night, and the only reason I ended up 3-1 was because my full HP Han Scoundrel got Disintegrated the very first time Boba took aim at him, in like the 5th round of the game. Init control hurt me that game too, as I lost like 4 in a row, but that was pretty lousy odds, and even with those odds, I still would've been winning without the big D.

The only other thing that I don't like about this kind of build is that if you go for the early strike, it means likely leaving the Speeder stranded half-way across the map in the first round. So, if you aren't able to eliminate your opponent's init control, it's quite likely you're going to get whalloped the beginning of the next round.

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 Post subject: Re: Speedy Cannon - Hoth Base
PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 1:09 pm 
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LoboStele wrote:
This is basically the same as the Han Speeder squad that somebody (I believe possibly Fingersandteeth) posted a few weeks back, with the Human BG and an Ugo swapped out for Dodonna and the Caamasi.


That version has been in my shoebox since we first heard of Dodonna. And back when TFU was new I made the original with a Twilick. So this isn't "new" at all per se, its the tricked out version for the new map. Matt and I decided the BG version is still superior to Dodonna last night, but other than that I understand its not "new". I think Flea had a squad something like this back when TFU was new as well and I think he was the one who had the name "Speedy Cannon" but I don't remember that for sure.

As far as San Hill/MTB squads go you have a couple of counters. First, you have the map roll. Obviously, winning map roll will help you a lot and pretty much negates any advantage they might have had with San (as it becomes a massive detriment during the very first round on this map). But second, on their map, lets say its Boba/Aurra and on Deathstar. Well, the Speeder and Han just mobile kill the fodder trying to cheat the gambit zone and deal with that as needed. Second, the Speeder is a great counter to Aurra and Boba as they do at most a whopping 20 dmg at range against it, barring crits. And even an early 20 by Boba doesn't kill it, heck, even a 20, then a hit doesn't kill it :). Just use the speeder as interference, take out lobot or some other costly piece as you have the opp and keep moving Han up to finish the job, or hide if the speeder takes out enough before it dies.

Now, the real issue is the Aurra/Tyranus MTB/San squad that I call San's Legacy. Again map means a lot here, as SL's map is likely Muunalist. Even still, you have to work hard to get shots as they approach and know that by round 4-5 you will lose either the speeder or Han. So play accordingly. Best bet is to work it as a draw as best you can and try to take down either Aurra or Tyranus as soon as possible.

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 Post subject: Re: Speedy Cannon - Hoth Base
PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2008 2:21 pm 
One of The Ones
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Well, with semi-decent rolling, should be able to take either Aurra or Tyranus without TOO much trouble. Tyranus could prove annoying if he stays in cover forcing you to deal with the +4 defense either that way, or via Duelist. But Aurra will be the easier piece to kill, and the more annoying piece to deal with overall due to her non-Melee attacks. Lack of init control could hurt, though depending on how far Aurra and Tyranus advance, it wouldn't be out of the question to do a deep strike with the speeder to wipe out either San or the MTB. I agree, Han should have no trouble keeping Ugs or Grans out of the Gambit area for the most part.

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