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 Post subject: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 12:35 pm 
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Official FAQ by NickName wrote:
Outside of Blaster (which has the potential to recieve errata changing the answers below) pretty straightforward set. Onward...

Commander Effects

Darth Sideous, Hologram
Q: Does this commander effect work on characters without a Force rating?
A: Yes.

Q: When a character without a Force rating receives Force Renewal and gains one or more Force points is it then considered to have a Force rating?
A: No, it just has Force points which may be spent to move faster or reroll an attack or save.

Special Abilities

Blaster
Q: Does Blaster use the normal targeting rules?
A: Yes.

Q: Would abilities like Jedi Hunter work when using Blaster?
A: Yes. It works like any other attack in regard to bonuses to Attack or Damage.

Q:.Does Blaster count as a nonmelee attack for something like Lightsaber Deflect or Evade?
A: No. It counts as a melee attack, and Parry and Lightsaber Block would be applicable defenses.

Invisibility
Q: Can a character with invisibility be targeted by targeted abilities when adjacent, or just attacks?
A: Targeted abilities may be used as well, if adjacent.

Q: Does a character with Invisibility still grant cover to a character behind it?
A: Yes.

Mines
Q: If a character moves into a square adjacent to two characters with Mines, does the character have to make two saves?
A: No. Multiple copies of the same ability do not stack. The character makes one Mines save when entering a particular affected square.

Q: Does a character with Flight have to make the Mines save?
A: Yes, it still moved into the square.

Q: If a character enters the adjacent square by disembarking a transport or being swapped in through a commander effect like Grand Admiral Thrawn's does it make a Mines save?
A: No. Those examples are not movement.

Resilient
Q: Is this immunity the same as for droids where it just prevents doubling of damage, or does it completely nullify the critical hit?
A: It nullifies the critical hit, but does not nullify the number rolled on the die. So damage would not be doubled, and something like the Chagrian Mercenary Commander's commander effect would not trigger, but Disintegration would still occur if a 20 was rolled.

Soresu Style Mastery
Q: Does Soresu Style Mastery work on all attacks, or just melee attacks?
A: Just melee attacks.



Last updated 11/6

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 12:41 pm 
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Cool, thanks Boba52! That's a remarkably short list, honestly.

There's a couple others I might have liked to know about, but they can be asked later.

Cool stuff.

Shame about Soresu....was borderline too powerful being able to negate both melee and non-melee attacks though. It's still pretty powerful as it is.

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 2:00 pm 
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I hope we'll see Blaster be changed. It is hard enough teaching a new player the basics of this game without getting into some of the complex interactions that can take place!

Interesting to see that gaining FR1 doesn't get you a force rating. I guess only when it specifically says it does (ie. Light Tutor) can you gain one.

I'd like to see a blanket statement for some of these things so that: ie. if they don't say they stack, they don't stack.


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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Fri Oct 31, 2008 5:46 pm 
One of the Sith on Malgus' Shuttle
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One thing to note is something that came up last night during a Sealed Tourney: Melee Reach 2 does not invoke Mines 20 if you are not adjacent. I checked with NN and that coulda saved me 20 damage, which wouldn't have mattered since Lackey still kicked the crap outa me, lol...


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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:50 am 
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I'm perfectly fine with Soresu working as it does (though personally I think this means they went entirely the wrong way on Obi... he's the ultimate anti-melee beatstick, and he's appearing vs. the revised super-shooters of the Separatists. If anything, Soresu should REVERSE that (shooter only)... not only thematically, but also for balance (keep in mind that every major tourney is being won by shooter-based squads).

As for the card misprint, I was disappointed before... now, to hear them say "oh, we meant that" just plain disgusts me. Look, own up to your mistakes... if you blow it, I'll forgive you (eventually), but what I will NOT forgive is lying and arrogance. Pinheads.

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Tue Nov 04, 2008 11:51 am 
Imperial Dignitaries
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Oh, and can someone explain Oddball? Penetration 20 and Grenades 20, but no penetration on his grenades, right? (and if yes, how absolutely idiotic is that?)

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 10:54 am 
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Made a couple updates to it recently so you may want to update the one in the first post here.

Rex was also confirmed 33 from the card. The number on the base is a mistake.

Grambo wrote:
As for the card misprint, I was disappointed before... now, to hear them say "oh, we meant that" just plain disgusts me. Look, own up to your mistakes... if you blow it, I'll forgive you (eventually), but what I will NOT forgive is lying and arrogance. Pinheads.


No one from WotC has commented one way or the other on why. I've covered how to interpret the situation based on what ended up in print and that's it. So while there may be lying, arrogance, or pinheadery based on what they end up saying, it's premature to make any judgement at the moment (except perhaps about speed of response.)

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 10:58 am 
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NickName wrote:
So while there may be lying, arrogance, or pinheadery based on what they end up saying, it's premature to make any judgement at the moment (except perhaps about speed of response.)


... or except perhaps about the fact that such responses are needed at all.

4 years later and the designers are still making basically the same mistakes. If Blaster is adjusted to be declared a non-melee attack, you can bet I will begin my campaign to make Lightsaber-based abilities melee as well.

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 10:59 am 
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Hey thanks NickName. Crap. I can't get into the site. My luck is only about 50/50 going to that place. Will update this post when successful.

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 11:41 am 
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Grand Moff Boris wrote:
If Blaster is adjusted to be declared a non-melee attack, you can bet I will begin my campaign to make Lightsaber-based abilities melee as well.


The difference here is that Lightsaber interactions have been discussed eleventeen times, and already adjusted once (showing WotC reevaluated them) and Blaster is from a brand new set and hasn't been discussed at all. But good luck, it's a simple change that wouldn't bother me in the least.

Add to melee attack...

Attacks using abilities that require adjacency (like Momentum or Lightsaber Assault) also count as melee attacks.

Such a change makes some already top teir characters more powerful than they already are so just be careful what you wish for...

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 12:04 pm 
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NickName wrote:
Grand Moff Boris wrote:
Such a change makes some already top teir characters more powerful than they already are so just be careful what you wish for...


How so? Name one example, please.

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 1:25 pm 
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Aurra Sing is currently vulnerable to characters with Deflect/Reflect. Making her Lighsaber melee allows her to get adjacent and pick and choose which defenses to get around.

Same basic deal with Mara Jedi.

Parry and block are much rarer on competetive pieces in general and the number of pieces with both melee and ranged defenses even moreso.

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 2:56 pm 
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NickName wrote:
Aurra Sing is currently vulnerable to characters with Deflect/Reflect. Making her Lighsaber melee allows her to get adjacent and pick and choose which defenses to get around.


There's a trade-off to that. It prevents her from getting the benefit of combined fire, and it also makes more sense. Check out the link "the truth about Star Wars Miniatures game play" in my WotC sig. I realize that it changes the interaction, but seriously it needs to be changed. I have taught a lot of people how to play since the game came out, and that is always one of the top 5 sticking points, trying to explain the interaction of a Lightsaber ability/power against adjacent enemies. It's not the only issue, but it's the biggest. And now there's a precedent to change it, 2 if Blaster gets the nod.

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Same basic deal with Mara Jedi.

Parry and block are much rarer on competetive pieces in general and the number of pieces with both melee and ranged defenses even moreso.


The flip side of that argument with Mara is that it gives some fragile pieces the chance to survive a 120 damage strike. IMO the pieces with Deflect/Evade are tougher characters anyway, for the most part (and btw, characters with Evade can't avoid the damage from Mara's LS Assault anyway, so it's a moot point there).

The only piece I see getting stronger from this change is Jarael, and she already has that strength built in against pieces like the GeoHaradan.

Ultimately, the change is negligible for game play, but cleans up the language in a way that's consistent - and easier - for new players to understand. So I'm for it. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 3:23 pm 
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They still grant cover, but they do not count as the closest target. It's no different than a Caamasi Noble in terms of how it works with Stealth.

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Thu Nov 06, 2008 7:27 pm 
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NickName wrote:

Attacks using abilities that require adjacency (like Momentum or Lightsaber Assault) also count as melee attacks.


This makes just too much sense. Charging Assault, LS Sweep.... Ha! Luke of Dagobah would end up with two similar FP's and both would count as different attacks... that is actually pretty interesting as far as the future of this game goes. I'm all for the above 'proposed' change. As Boris said, it is an absolute headache trying to explain all the different interactions for melee and non-melee to new players... along with everything else.


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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Sun Nov 16, 2008 9:52 pm 
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The new Barris Offee states on her card that while luminara is within 6 squares she gets +4 attack and Defense (This is under her Synergy ability) Under the glossary definition of synergy it says That a character with synergy gets +4 attack, Does Barris get the Synergy because her stat card says she does, or do I go with the Glossary definition and say she does not.

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Sun Nov 16, 2008 10:22 pm 
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Luke_Skywalker wrote:
The new Barris Offee states on her card that while luminara is within 6 squares she gets +4 attack and Defense (This is under her Synergy ability) Under the glossary definition of synergy it says That a character with synergy gets +4 attack, Does Barris get the Synergy because her stat card says she does, or do I go with the Glossary definition and say she does not.


viewtopic.php?f=7&t=5271&p=60456#p60456

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 12:56 am 
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Im with Boris too, minis like Aurra Sing JH and Mara Jedi are so powerful cause of the lightsaber ability, they can bring down in one turn a lot of minis (Big cost minis like all Windus) in one single assault, and is weird that he is attacking with a lightsaber but cant block it, it makes non sense in the game, and if you see the game with a little reality, so if it counts as a melee attack, they will be less powerful than they already are, cause they can combine fire, and almost nobody uses Mara with some spoter guys, but if she attacks an unactivated mini with spotter 20, she has an att of 20 and deals 50 dmg if hit so by giving her melee on those attacks, gives you a chance to survive :D

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 9:30 am 
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Chabelo Jedi Hunter wrote:
Im with Boris too, minis like Aurra Sing JH and Mara Jedi are so powerful cause of the lightsaber ability, they can bring down in one turn a lot of minis (Big cost minis like all Windus) in one single assault, and is weird that he is attacking with a lightsaber but cant block it, it makes non sense in the game, and if you see the game with a little reality, so if it counts as a melee attack, they will be less powerful than they already are, cause they can combine fire, and almost nobody uses Mara with some spoter guys, but if she attacks an unactivated mini with spotter 20, she has an att of 20 and deals 50 dmg if hit so by giving her melee on those attacks, gives you a chance to survive :D


In general, I also support this change. But don't make the mistake that doing so would make Aurra and Mara less powerful. It merely changes how they interact with particular minis. Those with deflect lose the ability to survive a Mara Assault. Those with block now gain it. Mara now has the choice to get around both deflect and block, not just deflect as it is now.

It makes these two minis better actually (although its only a marginal increase in power).

And btw, I've used Mara and Aurra with spotters all the time. Lou ran Garindan as a standard reinforcement for Aurra and Boba Merc at Gencon.

The issue of power with these two also must apply to all minis with a lightsaber if you are going to make a change for "sense reasons". Which is the primary reason people want it. It makes no more sense to only change the lightsaber +10 ability and not force Aurra's LS Sweep to also become a melee attack. It also means Cade will not cause splash when adjacent. It also likely means that Aurra and Mara get base 20 dmg when attacking adjacent, so now Mara's deadly attack gets the extra 10 on a crit (40 instead of 30, or 50 instead of 40 with cunning).

And if we go with the rule that is used for the Geo (I think the most logical) - Aurra and Mara must use their lightsaber when adjacent, which is why it must also be applied to all lightsaber non-melee figures in the game.

Net effect on the meta is that LS block goes up in value, and deflect loses a little - they do not offset however. Block is present on most of the good melee figures in the game already. They all get a lot better in top tier competition. Deflect only users like most Luke Skywalkers, lose some of their value. Personally, I am pretty sure that block is a cheaper power than deflect in most of these characters, and that will have a major effect on the meta.

So while I would support a change, please be clear about what it would do to other figures in the game. I will never support a change to only the LS +10 rule without dealing with all of it, that makes it even more stupid and less real than the current rules. It needs to be all or nothing. Right now, its pretty easy to explain to people - if the card says melee, its melee. The Geo is an easy one to explain as well as its right on the card. This change would be infinitely more confusing if its not consistent because its not on the cards. Please be clear about that before you make any decision about this.

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Wars Mini FAQ
PostPosted: Wed Nov 19, 2008 9:39 am 
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Also you may look at what figures will become more valuable to field, Obi-Wan and Dooku of Serreno will be more valuable because when they base a non-Melee lightsaber user they will gain the benefit of their Mastery allowing for a "Free" block on all attacks. Characters with Parry gain a boost also, Felcor/Jarael.

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