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 Post subject: Lightsaber Assault Clarification
PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 7:14 am 
Jedi Knight
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Lightsaber Assault (Force 1, replaces attacks: Make 2 attacks)

Ok so I was at my LGS last night and I got into a discussion with someone over the use of Lightsaber Assault and Twin Attack. A&E Mara was the character in question.

Correct me if I am wrong, but....If a character uses LA and has twin attack they make a total of 4 attacks.

The other person was trying to say that because it says replaces attacks it ignores her TA SA. I would agree with that statement if it was double and not twin.

from the FAQ:

Q: Does Twin Attack stack with Double Attack, giving four attacks, or two attacks against two different targets?
A: Yes.

I just wanted clarification.

Thanks in advance

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 Post subject: Re: Lightsaber Assault Clarification
PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 7:45 am 
Master of the Order
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You are absolutely right. If a character has Twin Attack (like Mara Jade Jedi) and uses the Lightsaber Assault special ability, they make a total of 4 attacks against an adjacent target. That last part is the key that you have to remember, since it doesn't specify it on Mara's card. She has to be adjacent to a target in order to use Assault.

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 Post subject: Re: Lightsaber Assault Clarification
PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 7:47 am 
Jedi Knight
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yeah of course.....I just printed out the FAQ's I am going to start carrying them around with me so ppl believe me when I say things like that.

hehe mara still won even without assulting off my opponent.

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 Post subject: Re: Lightsaber Assault Clarification
PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 9:59 am 
Warmaster
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you should have told your opponent "Yes you are right it replaces my normal attacks, but right in the ability is says "Lightsaber Assault (Force 1, replaces attacks: Make 2 attacks)" :)


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 Post subject: Re: Lightsaber Assault Clarification
PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2008 10:14 am 
Master of the Order
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Well, I can see how that would confuse people a little, because the definition says "make 2 attacks" not "make 4 attacks", and technically, you'd be making 4 attacks with Twin. So I definitely know where the trouble comes in. We had a similar discussion at one of my LGS recently too. The easier way to think about it is that the word 'attacks' is treated as if it's a Special Ability all on its own. So, anytime you see the word 'attack' on a card, then it should trigger you to treat it as a Special function, not just an action you are performing. That way, you are always reminded with things say they either "replace attacks" or "when hit by an attack" or "whenever this character attacks" etc., that you know to go straight to the definition of 'Attack' first, before you try to define anything else.

So, the word 'attack' in the SWM game, is an ability that specifically means a process of declaring targets, applying special abilities or Force Powers, rolling the dice, adding your attack modifier, comparing to the defense value, and then assessing damage and any other special effects. If any other ability you are trying to use affects one of those parts, then you consider it at that time. Yes, it can be a bit confusing.

The real problem I run into is when people want to argue how they think the game should work, and when they are shown exactly the way it's supposed to be played, they continue to argue, instead of just accepting the truth, and learning to play accordingly.

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 Post subject: Re: Lightsaber Assault Clarification
PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 5:04 pm 
Unnamed Wookiee
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LoboStele wrote:
The real problem I run into is when people want to argue how they think the game should work, and when they are shown exactly the way it's supposed to be played, they continue to argue, instead of just accepting the truth, and learning to play accordingly.


I could tend to agree, except in cases where wizards lacked foresight in setting the rules. For example: it's illegal to use accurate shot to shoot missiles, reason: targeting.
Yet it's legal to use mobile attack to shoot a missile, reason: (?) So sometimes reason gets tossed, and yes there should be an angle of just accepting, except wizards is the only game designer that I found which allows the rules to vary from one lgs to another. So a players best defense is unfortunately to print out and bring a stack of rulings with them for their squads.
A second example would be the Force Adept utilizing the Force weapon, and it working with the ithorian commander. While Darth Vader, Champion's C.E. doesn't work. A simple answer is stacking, yet why is the Force Weapons +10 legal? Sometimes the "simple" rules aren't so simple. Edit: Got answer on this...it has to do with the size of your D....hmmmm...ok so that doesn't sound so good.

I don't want it to come across like I'm challenging, and hopefully my post here doesn't take that flare or flavor. Logically, I wouldn't be so stupid as to take that stance against someone who's posted 3,000+ times as they are known by everyone, and me, well, I'd just like to avoid a bad rap. I really do appreciate all of the volunteer hours several of you put into making the gaming experience w/swmini's better for everyone. And to boot, I've never seen a more positive i'net boards for a game. Very little negativity directed at other members. (well actually...maybe I just haven't read enough threads, lol.) Seriously though you all are a bunch of great guys.

So for the time being we gamers just keep it fun, light, and try our best to stay updated on here for specific rulings.

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 Post subject: Re: Lightsaber Assault Clarification
PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 4:54 am 
Warmaster
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Grand Admiral wrote:
1. For example: it's illegal to use accurate shot to shoot missiles, reason: targeting.
Yet it's legal to use mobile attack to shoot a missile, reason: (?)

2. A second example would be the Force Adept utilizing the Force weapon, and it working with the ithorian commander. While Darth Vader, Champion's C.E. doesn't work. A simple answer is stacking, yet why is the Force Weapons +10 legal? Sometimes the "simple" rules aren't so simple.


Okay yeah, sometimes rulings go against common convention, mostly cuz english is nasty and well Rob can't be expected to see EVERY Possible interaction players might dream up with his limited time schedual.

But for the 2 examples you gave, it's actually very logical.

1. Accurate shot affects targeting rules for Attacks (when you roll a dice) only, where Mobile alters movement rules (which say you can move then attack/replace attacks, or A/Ra then move), and Missles is a RA SA not a attack. Why you also can't accurate a missile, it's Not a attack but a SA.

2. Actually this IS obvious.. Force Weapon is a Force power, not a CE, so the Stacking Rules are clear, with FW's +10 and IC's CE +10 both stacking as both bonus's to the same stat coming from difference source forms. one power, one CE. the Stack rule only says that 2 bonus from matching Source forms (aka 2 CE's) will not stack.

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