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Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB
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Author:  greentime [ Thu Sep 13, 2012 5:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

If you use Sense the Future against someone running Tactics Broker, does that just mean that your initiative of 1 is now theirs (and you get whatever they rolled)?

Author:  Sithborg [ Thu Sep 13, 2012 5:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

Tactics Broker will still make you roll a 1, after you switch rolls, thus Sense the Future has no effect.

Author:  The_Celestial_Warrior [ Thu Sep 13, 2012 5:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

Sithborg wrote:
Tactics Broker will still make you roll a 1, after you switch rolls, thus Sense the Future has no effect.


I can't decide if that dumb, and just dumb luck on MTB's part

or

incredibly masterful rules writing on WotC's part.


Though, it would be fun to run these on the same squad.

Author:  DeathsBaine [ Thu Sep 13, 2012 5:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

Sithborg wrote:
Tactics Broker will still make you roll a 1, after you switch rolls, thus Sense the Future has no effect.



Yeah, but would their roll not also become a 1 resulting in a tie? then you would reroll and the tactics broker would not be in effect right?

Author:  urbanjedi [ Thu Sep 13, 2012 5:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

My assumption would be that you would get what your opp rolled and your opp would get a 1? How else would you switch init checks? Because the ghost says after init is determined I assume it means after regular tactician, tactics broker, recon, etc have been resolved.

Author:  thereisnotry [ Thu Sep 13, 2012 6:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

Yeah, that's what I would think too. Once your Init result has become a 1 and their roll was a [2-20], you use Sense The Future and switch init results.

I don't envy your job, Scott! :)

Author:  swinefeld [ Fri Sep 14, 2012 10:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

Agreed. "After initiative is determined" is the key wording. Tactics broker should not change the result at that point. Sense the Future is not equivalent to Recon/Anticipation.

IMO :)

Author:  TimmerB123 [ Fri Sep 14, 2012 12:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

Does Republic really need another trump? They already are the strongest faction. I know a ruling on this should be independent of that, but that really sucks.

Author:  Sithborg [ Fri Sep 14, 2012 1:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

You are only switching the physical roll. All modifiers to it still only apply to you. (Tactician, Tactics Broker)

It does appear that I may need to tweak the wording a bit to be more clear.

Author:  TimmerB123 [ Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:51 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

Sithborg wrote:
You are only switching the physical roll. All modifiers to it still only apply to you. (Tactician, Tactics Broker)

Author:  TimmerB123 [ Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

TimmerB123 wrote:
Sithborg wrote:
You are only switching the physical roll. All modifiers to it still only apply to you. (Tactician, Tactics Broker)

Thank God!

Author:  Echo [ Mon Sep 17, 2012 8:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

It makes sense. If your opponent has Tactician +4 and rolls a 7 and you roll a 6, if you switch you don't get an 11 and give him a 6, you get a 7 and he winds up with a 10 (6+4). Right? So all Tacticians actually counter Sense the Future pretty well, since you have to roll X lower than them when they have Tactician +X.

Author:  jonnyb815 [ Mon Sep 17, 2012 3:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

Wow really. Looks like the mtb is even better. Still the best piece I my eyes. I hate that piece.

Author:  jonnyb815 [ Mon Sep 17, 2012 3:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

Sithborg wrote:
You are only switching the physical roll. All modifiers to it still only apply to you. (Tactician, Tactics Broker)

It does appear that I may need to tweak the wording a bit to be more clear.

Really Scott now we are adding physical rolls to the rules. Before a roll was a roll even by a sa.

So reserves don't get changed by tactian?

Author:  Sithborg [ Mon Sep 17, 2012 3:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

It's always been that way. See "Natural 20". What was rolled and what the result are two different things. I missed something here, sure. And I will be rectifying it, since I know how it was intended to work. Out of the 4 pages of glossary I had to do for just this one set, I would say I didn't do too badly.

Author:  Weeks [ Mon Sep 17, 2012 5:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

Sithborg wrote:
It's always been that way. See "Natural 20". What was rolled and what the result are two different things. I missed something here, sure. And I will be rectifying it, since I know how it was intended to work. Out of the 4 pages of glossary I had to do for just this one set, I would say I didn't do too badly.



I don't have a problem with how it works. I think qui-Gon is more of a fun piece to pair with a reserves squad anyway.

MTB is such a hard build to run that I don't mind it being immune to dead qui-Gon.

Author:  swinefeld [ Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:30 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

Sithborg wrote:
It's always been that way. See "Natural 20". What was rolled and what the result are two different things. I missed something here, sure. And I will be rectifying it, since I know how it was intended to work. Out of the 4 pages of glossary I had to do for just this one set, I would say I didn't do too badly.

Yeah, quite a monster of a glossary for one set. You've done very well.

I think the way it works makes sense and is balanced.

---
In general, I'd like to see more emphasis on the card text giving enough info to understand how stuff works at a glance. This one would have been clearer if it mentioned that modifiers are applied after the roll switch.

I understand it isn't always possible with complex effects, and space on the card can be an issue, as in this case. Not complaining, just something I think could help lower the learning curve as the game continues to expand. :)

Author:  Sithborg [ Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

For the most part, we've done pretty well getting almost everything on the card text. There were a few cases where glossary expansion was necessary (Advanced Door Gimmick).

Author:  swinefeld [ Tue Sep 18, 2012 10:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Qui-Gon Force Spirit and MTB

Sithborg wrote:
For the most part, we've done pretty well getting almost everything on the card text. There were a few cases where glossary expansion was necessary (Advanced Door Gimmick).


Agreed, and much better than WotC managed with some stuff. I didn't intend to suggest there is a big problem. Just something to keep an eye on. :)

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