Fool wrote:
I think we're starting to see a split in the types of Game players out there and it's distinct.
There has always been this divide of players. Always. Actually over the 5 years this game has been around i've drifted from being purely fun (and resentful of the competitive environment) to cut throat competitive as well as fun.
The difference between competitive and fun players tends to be that the former will push the extent of the rules in a tourney or casual environment to test squads for their effectiveness. They'll use the best pieces and practice with them so when a tourney comes about they know where the top lies.
Fun players want to try interesting and unusual combos no matter what the rules set often avoiding the real competitive gimmicks because they don't want to be 'that guy' who plays these cut throat teams.
These days the gap is more noticeable not because there is larger split of players but because the strength of the game
at the top and bottom is widening.
I remember when R2 was the broken piece. We had a tourney where we altered the rules of override because of its strength.
Then it became r2 astromech.
Then thrawn became dominant with auto init.
Double override.
Then JWMs entered.
Boba BH brought R2 back
Now MTBs are problems.
When your playing just for fun where do you start to draw the line as to what is 'fun' and what is too competitive for teh casual game when what was once seen as competitive is now t2 or t3?
Its a difficult distinction because you then get an arbitrary level of what is fun and not depending on the opinion of the player and its due to the fact that the game is becoming quite vast in its scope.
The only way to really decide between players is either make up a set of rules that you can both explore the strongest squads within or you construct squads together.
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There's those of us that would love to win with PUHR Justice. That would be awesome! And if we lose 9/10 games, for that one game we won, it's all worth it.
Its this really true? You play PUHR justice and are constantly trucked by Thrawn+ss, Mara and Han GH with MTB, San hill etc until you come up against a squad you actually beat and then you can say that the last 9 games which weren't even games they were so one sided were worth it?
Wouldn't it be better to define a set of rules that allows squads like these to compete so the game is exciting?
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This type of player also enjoys things like the GVL, GFC and fun elements like TacRPG, Dynamic Duo and sometimes 1,000 points matches for the fun of it.
Many players, including competitive players like these formats because the rules are set so you can just go to town coming up with the strongest squads within.
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There's others that play for the entire Competitive/Meta DCI Aspect of the game. They don't really understanding waisting their time with less competitive Leagues, Tournaments and squads because that's not the joy in it for them which is totally fine too. There's absolutely nothing wrong with that at all.
These people exist but i think they are fewer in number than you realize. Some of the strongest game stores (lobo's game store for example) have casual tourneys where the rules are messed around in order to allow people to come up with weird and wacky squads.
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I just think that because we're seeing such a significant change of Meta the bridge between the specific and distinct player types grows even larger. This gap, although minute maybe 3 sets ago has grown and grown. From here I'm not sure if there's really anyway back and that's the only sad thing.
I quite agree with this, i think its the same point as the first one I made but i think there is always a way back. You just implement house rules to play a more fun style.
Example - 200 points, no super-stealth, no MT, no mas, max 2 uniques, and at least 15 troopers per side.
Set for an imperial v rebel trooper war right there. I think imperials might have the edge with all their defense but the rebels do have twin, missiles and Bothans.
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My observation is that the "fun" player will always play. They may not be keeping up to all the sets, they probably don't play competitively that often (or maybe they do) but they relish in the Star Wars-esque and fun part of the game. The problem I see with the second type of player (the competitive one) is that if the Meta ever gets "Stupid" and stops being fun for them, or the challenge of winning isn't interesting, or the format of the Championship is changed then they will probably move onto some other type or game format.
i agree and disagree with this.
The fun players are just as equally likely to drop the game because its 'stupid' as a competitive gamer is likely to drop the game because the meta is 'stupid'.
The crux of this argument is that there arn't really SWM players who play totally competitively. There is really no prize support for this game so you don't have professional players like magic. You have people who like to win more than others but the game still draws its base from StarWars fans and that is the key point that binds the people who play this game.
I haven't met one person who plays and collects this game that doesn't love star wars. I don't really see this point changing because WotC just doesn't want to invest too much money in something that isn't their sole intellectual property.
They make money off a good product and they are probably happy with that but they can't bank on this game being around for years because LF can take away the game any time they decide the license has run its course.
The game will always be what you make it. WotC do design a competitive sphere of SWM and a lot of people enjoy figuring out what squads that entails but the game has so much depth to it that you can taylor it to have any kind of battle you want, the results just might not be what you thought (imperial slaughter instead of rebel victory).
To get back to the topic of the OP.
This game still feels like starwars to me, even at the highest competitive level.
On SUnday i had General Dodonna instructing Old man Han, Mara and Kyle on how to defeat luke in his snowspeeder, Wat tambor and his troop of droids, and Kota with Cade and R2. It felt like my squad was a post RotJ band.
The main characters pop out at you. When you play a Han it feels like Han, play a leia and she feels and contributes like you imagine she would. Lukes are finally being made like you imagine he should be. R2 is always annoying. Thrawn is the mastermind who controls his army. Boba is the most feared BH in the galaxy.
There aren't many pieces that make to stop and think, 'ew thats not how it should be'.
there are always wierd and wonderful SW alien species all over the board from uggies, kel dors, grans, biths, Chagrins etc that bring the cantina atmosphere to life.
There are more and more pieces coming in from the fringe and EU so it may feel slightly less like the OT but the whole game exudes the star wars feel.
When the strongest figures are always made to be the most recognizable i don't see how you can imagine it being anything else. The game mechanics might change but its always gonna be han, leia, r2, thrawn, vader, boba, aurra or some EU general running the show. Can't get anymore star wars than that.