So this is my idea. That's it, I am officially copyrighting this one.

Seriously though, this is my prediction for the next "major" squad design:

GLD
45 Garm Bel Iblis
27 Lobot
09 Jan Dodonna

From there, whether you are playing 100, 150, or 200, you can cater your squad to deal with just about anything. Okay, maybe not 100, and it may be a bit more challenging in 150, but definitely 200.

Think about it. You can completely tailor the support pieces of your squad to fit the situation. Dealing with Thrawn? Bring in MTB, Ugs, and Mon Cals.
Dealing with Superstealth? Bring in a Correlian Security Officer and some Aqualish Assassins.

The things you can't deal with via Reinforcements are easily dealt with through the rest of your squad make-up, whether you are playing NR or Rebels. Plus, there are all sorts of synergies just waiting to be found between the 2 factions, thanks to Garm.

Mara Jedi + Bothan Noble.
Rebel Captain + Galactic Trooper

The options are endless with this, especially, as I said, at 200 point play. Once I get Dodonna and some of the new commons and uncommons I doubt I will really mess with anything else until I get the mixture down right.

Umm, what else will you bring at 100? I don't see many 21 pt pieces worth getting 71 pts of support. Potential, yes, but way too early to call it the gatekeeper.

I played a similar squad a few weeks ago, with Garm, Kasdan, Lobot, Rodian Vigo, Rauntaun, etc. The trouble I ran into was pieces that could actually do damage and hurt, say, a Golan Turret. Even with reinforcements, it's tough to find a lot of good reinforcements to be competitive.

Of course, it didn't help that I never got reserves AT ALL until the 4th game...

Okay, so forget about 100 and try to focus on the whole of the discussion.

We'll see. Definately has potential, but I think there are so many ramifications from some of these figs, that it is FAR too early to make these calls.

It's because you're not really paying attention to the pattern of this set. Legacy of the Counters.

Yeah, NR is pretty much the counter faction right now. Things are going to change like crazy. Ever so much fun. While I am sure that stuff will be at the top table, but will it be THE top? A bit early for me to say, really.

Hell, I'm still trying to decide whether I want to play Vong or Kyle more.

the NR are going to be so much fun to play, they might actually take time away from me playing San at 150 if/when I can figure out a good build for them. Where you thinking about using Kyle at 150 or 200 more, Sithborg?

At all levels, at all levels...

got any ideas at 150? I'm coming up dry I take it you're a huge Katarn fan too? I grew up with him. The original Dark Forces game was the third FPS I got for PC!

I really think that the NR has two seperate possibilities for squad construction: Something similar to what Boris has going here, and the counter-squad. not sure what the final builds will look like til we see the concrete stats and have the minis in hand, though.

I give some credit to Boris for the "fully customizable" squad, as I was thinking of something similar when I saw Dodonna, only minus Lobot. See as a San Hill fan, I was drooling over the possibility of a notion I've always liked: a free gambit gaining turret in a San Hill squad. Well now you can, using Jan instead of San (wow, lots of rhymes). Use the same big guns (a Boba, Lando, CS Aurra, maybe Jariah or Deliah now), some cheap activations, and there you go. Nevermind you have access to all the rebels (mobile Hans, force pushers) and the NR if you want to experiment a bit. Bring in a Hoth Turret every time and get yourself guaranteed free gambit points. Whereas with San you had to run a free uggy or something up to get the gambit, now you have it at set up. On a map with an open gambit (Mustafar, Geonosis, Death Star) you get gambit while you opponent has to face your late round shooters to catch up, of course putting himself in a bigger hole. Heck at 200, throw in a Bothan Noble and your shooters get even nastier:

Garm 45 (turret and mon cal)
Boba, BH 62
Han, RH 35
Lando, DS 18
Dodonna 9
Bothan Noble 17
Last 14: activations like uggies (maybe R2 or Juno?)
Total: 200

Three mobile shooters, two have accurate, Bothan can combo with Boba or Lando if need be. If you win initiative, you mobile out and pound with Boba and Han. If you lose, turtle and jump out after everyone has activated a-la San. Obviously people would have their own versions using Lobot (like Boris said) for the extra customizing, but of course there are many options that fit each person's playing style.

For 150, either downgrade to Boba, Enforcer or use Deliah or Jariah:

Garm 45 (turret and mon cal)
Han, RH 35
Jariah 24
Dodonna 9
Bothan Noble 17
Extra 20 points of whatever you like (maybe a Rauntaun and 2 uggies)
Total: 150

Jariah with Han's CE can nail a Jedi at +18 for 70 damage if initiative is won (make that 140 if you use the Bothan)! That's pretty cool. Or put in Boba Enforcer instead if you prefer the accurate mobile.

Obviously there is a lot of wiggle room here and I couldn't possibly think up all the options (there are a ton flying through my head), but you guys get the point: a Jan Hill squad with free gambit and access to all the great Rebel/NR/Fringe shooters is like super San Hill. I'd love to hear everyone's versions. Maybe some of you would skip the whole Turret option and bring in more toys, but I guess that's what Boris was saying: the flexibility to tailor fit your squad, plus activation control, is one nasty combo.

I agree that Garm is going to show up a lot because he gives access to so many good "counter" figures but only when you need them. He now has access to:

The crazy powerful immediate attack CE (Bothan Noble)
Override (Elite Rebel Commando)
Bodyguard (Rebel Honor Guard - not a great option but sometimes you might want it)
It's a Trap! (CSO)
Deceptive via CE (CSO again - great for a Dodonna squad!)

And a few interesting fire support pieces. These are all in addition to his old tricks of the Turret, the Troop Cart, Mon Cal Activations, Verpine Jolt, Tauntaun Recon, Ithorian Commander, WFF's, Rebel Vanguard, etc. He's become a much more versatile swiss army knife.

But most of his tricks are either gimmicks, or they are counters to other gimmicks. In a certain sense, he's a 45 point defensive piece. What do you do if your opponent has a straightforward power squad (like most of the top squads at Gen Con last year) that doesn't require that you play any of these counters but just requires a pure offensive boost? I suppose you bring another Bothan Noble and use him to pump up your big attacker, but that's perhaps not a very good use of 45 points.

I would argue that Lobot is pretty much a defensive piece too. He lets you shield 20 kill points from being awarded to your opponent; he lets you bring extra activations if needed to counter your opponent's activations; he lets you build a squad around the MTB but protect your squad from the being screwed if you face San or NTMTO; he lets you bring bodyguards if needed, etc.

Lobot + Garm might be too much defense and not enough offense.

The other way to look at Garm is as a way to realize interesting synergies between Rebel and NR pieces. Once I tried a Mara Jolt squad and it was fun but not that great. I'm just not sure there are any such synergies worth paying that many points for... but you can bet I'll try to find them!

I definetly see this as being powerful, although it's a little costly already. It's pretty much super JAN HILL. I wonder if San is finally dead after this set.

Not at all. And his name is Dodanna. That other crap needs to die...

Boris Said is a NASCAR driver, what does he have to do with meta?

So I played a sample game with this last night:

Boba Mercenary
Garm Bel Iblis
Lobot
General Dodonna
R2-D2
Ugnaught Demolitionist

vs. the new "R&B"

for my reinforcements I took
Garm - Bothan Noble; Galactic Alliance Scout
Lobot - Keldor Bounty Hunter; Ugnaught x2

We played on Death Star, and wow did this squad rock! Let me revise, wow did Dodonna and Boba Merc rock! Early game, I outactivated my opponent, despite her having more activations than me, and mid-game, Boba's intuition + the Bothan Noble allowed for three 90-damage shots (it was enough to defeat Fel, thanks to a combined fire shot from the Galactic Scout in a previous round).

Was the R&B running Ozzel?

Nice job though. I'd be worried about having only one real damage dealing piece in my squad though. Too much chance for the dice to screw you one time and then it's game over.

No.
This was the Fel squad:

Fel
Thrawn
Storm Commando
Mas Amedda
Ugnaught x2
Raxus Prime Trooper x5



Yes, I agree, but at 200 it's going to be even better. You can pick up a second shooter. I would drop R2 and have 58 or so points to work around until I find the right mix.

I'm not sure how beneficial Ozzel would really be with this. Dodonna lets me match him on activations, so I can still outactivate, until it becomes a disadvantage for the Empire squad.

Well, your squad should beat that every single time then, simply because of Dodonna. Even if you burn Boba's activation early in a round, you're still likely to be OK, as you can activate 1 till the end of the round, and still get some shots off on Dodonna.

Though, I think I would play it where, if you did activate Boba early on for any particular reason, I would run up a Stormie, then Swap Fel into place. You don't have enough pieces on your squad to worry about a few 10 point damage hits here and there. And then Fel does what he can to Boba. Then win init (via Thrawn), Triple, then Swap back out. Might not work too well though, as I can't think of any reason to activate Boba early in a round except to shoot at Fel.

Oooh, nevermind, Boba can just Intuition away from Fel. Ouch. Yeah, DEFINITELY need Ozzel and no Storm Commando in order to have any chance at all against your squad. Gotta have the 1 activation per phase, and more activations total. Although, you could still bring a Bothan Noble, and then fodder activations, and still reach 16 total, which is more than the R&B squad. So it's going to be a tough battle no matter what I think. Very interesting.

Ozzel totally negates the power of Thrawn swap IMO.

Here's what happened: After my opponent activated out, I moved Boba up 3 squares from behind a wall and took my shots. Then my Noble would activate and Boba took another shot.
Next round, I intuition back to hiding if I can't get a good shot in. Even running 12 squares, the troopers could just never get close enough to position a good swap maneuver without putting Fel at risk. I would even chance getting smacked via Intuition to get a pair of Double shots off, and then move 3 squares away. The Noble healed any and all damage Boba took during the game.



Yep.