*sigh*

fine, how about this rather lengthy rebuttal.

Does R2 astromech really do anything to the republic to set it over the edge anymore? Does it make the republic any stronger than the rebels with Princess Leia's absurd commander effect, 21-bs insane healing, chewie enormous BDG'd? The imperials with Vaders super accurate throw, Ozzel, thrawn and all their sick CE's.
Against San hill R2 is a 9 point liability.
I'm not sure why we are treading back 6 sets to a time where r2 may actually have been overboard. He clearly meets his match in many factions.

[/quote][/quote]

old Melee reach 2 - poor game mechanics, hard to understand, it needed simplification which is what the errata gave
Ysalimiri - the same as above or not as the designers intended, the change was implemented within a set.

Not sure where your going with troop cart, i didn't realise there was gonna be an errata but if i had to guess why i would suggest its because of overly complicated gameplay, NOT because of its relative strength.

Why am i so rigid? R2 6 sets old, it works great, its a strong mechanic and it unique to the republic. It opens the game to a large amount of squad styles and he is quite a vulnerable character with a vast amount of pieces that can expose and kill him rapidly. I see no reason to change him he's nowhere near breaking the game.

tow cable and JWMs are really the only things keeping the Republic in the top tier anymore. If you reword it to weaken it, You would be weakening the Republic to the point where their top tier status would be in serious jeopardy. I mean, with all the new dual Rep/Rebel Jedi, the only reason I build Republic squads is to take advantage of tow cable. If you take away what makes it so useful in a re-wording, you take away any reason for me to build a Republic squad at all.

Wow, I hadn't realized so many were so passionate about this topic. I appreciate all the comments and views. I still would like to see a Mustafar Panning Droid mini some day, just no Tow Cable ability on it. Now, play nice, boys.

Just so that everyone is aware of what the I Can't Believe It's Not Butter argument actually is:

Alice: You know that stuff they're selling now at the local shop?
Geraldine:Which stuff?
Alice: I Can't Believe It's Not Butter.
Geraldine:Oh yes
Alice: Well, I can't believe it's not butter.
Geraldine: Yeah, well I believe that is the idea, yeah.
Alice:Then yesterday, I went to Crookenden and I bought this other stuff, like a sort of home-brand, you know?
Geraldine: Yes...
Alice: And you know, I can't believe it's not I Can't Believe It's Not Butter
Geraldine: Mmm. I'm losing you now.
Alice: Well, you know I Can't Believe It's Not Butter?
Geraldine: Yeah, you think it is butter.
Alice: No no, I mean you know the stuff that I can't believe is not butter is called I Can't Believe It's Not Butter.
Geraldine: Probably, yeah, yeah.
Alice: Well I can't believe the stuff that is not I Can't Believe It's Not Butter is not I Can't Believe It's Not Butter and I can't believe that both I Can't Believe It's Not Butter and the stuff that I can't believe is not I Can't Believe It's Not Butter are both, in fact, not butter. And I believe they both might be butter, in a cunning disguise. And in fact there's a lot more butter around than we all thought there was.


I do in general agree with finger's points though. Tow Cable is a ridiculous ability, the in-universe logic of it really is quite baffling. I thought R2 Astromech was ridiculously good when RotS came out, I still think it's a ridiculously good figure. It's so ridiculously good that I can't picture playing a Republic squad without it. Why wouldn't you? It's because of R2 Astromech that I'm so fond of 30 damage Accurate Shot.

All that said, with the current state of the game it can be dealt with easily enough. Plenty of area-affect damage (Splash, Missiles, Flamethrower, Force Push 5, Force Lightning...) and even Force Push to separate Tower/Towee. If ever there was a time that R2 Astromech needed a fix, it was post-RotS pre-Universe. Before Fringe Override, before Ugnaughts, before even the Nightsister Sith Witch "Shock Therapy" squad. Why pick on R2 Astromech these days when we have board-wipe Thrawn swapping?

I do hope we get another Tow Cable figure in future... but that figure better be another Republic faction R2, a bit different to the current R2 Astromech. Just for the sole purpose of making it easier for new players to get access to this ability, instead of having to track down a VR released 4 years ago.

No it would not hurt but still hope no one else gets it. Same with BV or force immunity, should be kept on one faction to help that faction remain unique. (ok i know 2 factions have access to BV but you get what i mean)

I can't believe it's not "punxnbutter" ahhhh yes a crummy crummy joke on my name. I apologize

The idea of bringing in R2-AM into NR through affinity is pretty good. If its going to be brought to other factions it'd be nice to force that expenditure of points and keep it on R2. Not so sure about OR though; I'd like to see some other gimmick to break movement...something unique for them

NR should never have R2 AM at this point. They already have Han ST.

I am for the NR getting an R2, and I think that the new Han might be very good and prohibit the 50 points it takes to get StormieHan into the NR. As an off-the-wall idea I thought about allowing another character bring a character named R2-D2 into the faction, thus allowing for the republic or rebel versions. You're right that Tow cable on top of Han ST is too much, as I outlined in my example of why the Rebels should never get tow cable. Ultimately to avoid that combo, the character that brings R2 into the faction, (a new NR(Living) Luke perhaps?) would have to be very high-costed himself. Maybe even the upcoming/future NR Han that allows for 1 droid named R2-D2 or C-3PO to join the NR would be possible, thus eliminating the possibility of the combo. When it comes right down to it Bill, you're right that the NR can't get tow cable and Han, ST. I'm just pushing forward a few alternative ideas that would be fun, not overpowering, and accurate for the story. Not having R2 in the NR is just as egregious as not having a NR Chewie/ some way to get a Chewie into the NR.

DR, I like your thinking. And I would be very much in favor of any of those ideas. I just fear the Mara 26 square twin attack

Yeah I fear Mara being able to move (essentially) the entire length of the board on one turn and twin for 60 damage as well Bill. I just think that R2-affinitied character to be named later, R2-AM, Jaina, and Han ST would be too cost prohibitive to make a good build around if they ever decided to bring R2 in through affinity in any format other than 200. Then it would be an issue if your venue likes 200 (as mine does), but it would not hurt gencon (presumably) If they ever do make a NR character that brings in R2, it should be a Han just for the sake of not even allowing the combo to exist. I'm kind of hoping that the new NR Han gives them ample reason to stop using Jaina, even though she is pretty solid for her points. That is the impetus for my desire for the NR to have another movement breaker, because I hope to be able to get beyond relying on Jaina to make a decent NR build.

Well I can agree with you guys there, someone having Han ST and R2 Astro would be out of hand. But hopefully the new Han will be good enough to always have in in NR.

I like the idea, but not the Tow Cable execution, how about this:

Panning Droid 15pts
Fringe

HP: 20
Def: 14
Atk: 0
Dam: 0

Special Abilities
Flight; Droid
Medium Repulsor Lift (Can carry 1 small or medium ally that ends its turn adjacent to this character before it activates. Place that character on top of this Panning Droid. When carrying a small or medium character, Panning Droid gains Speed 4 and cover. Characters transported in this manner activate when this character activates, count as an activation during the phase, do not provoke attacks of opportunity when moved by this character and can attack counting range from this character. Characters transported in this manner are not considered to have moved for the purposes of special abilities. A transported character may be placed adjacent to this character at the end of their turn. If this character is defeated, a transported character takes 20 damage, and is placed in the square formally occupied by Panning Droid.)
Protected (When this character is transporting a small or medium ally, that ally gains Droid Defender.)

Well, that was wordy! Basically you'd have to have an appendix addition to this because it doesn't spell it all out. The idea represents Anakin floating around on this thing attacking Obi-wan in RotS and so you gain a movement breaker of 8 squares, but you can pull off multiple attacks, with Careful Shot and the applicable SA's, (not Momentum, Charging Fire, etc.) Can't interrupt your Multiple Attacks or anything. It's like you can give Flight to any character, but you pay for it by giving up an activation and increasing the cost.

Whaddya think? Is 15pts too cheap? At 103pts, would Revan be too overpowered? 99pts for Exar to get to move 8 and triple, is that too powerful? At 65pts, RS Boba might be fun to tow around and take a double attack, is it worth it? I dunno, just something I was thinkin up during this whole discussion over Tow Cable.

I like it. I might just adjust the Speed 4 to Speed 3, so that should you be based with an opponent's melee beatstick, you can't run away further than the melee character can catch up to and still attack (minor thing, and Force users can still use a FP anyway, but still...).

I do like the 20 damage should the droid be destroyed. It likely won't last long with 20 HP, so you can probably assume your carried character is going to take the damage. Flamethrower is the perfect counter to this thing; take out the droid and 40 damage to the carried character? Sure! I do like figures which provide powerful advantages, but have built-in drawbacks. R2 Astromech has no drawback to using Tow Cable, which would have been nice to see.

Someone mentioned that Han NR could maybe bring in R2-D2 AD into the NR. Why i think that anything is possible i think if Han had Affinity for anything it's more likely going to be Chewie ( a character who's name contains Chewbacca).

Given time i think C-3PO and R2-D2 will be made for NR anyway with or without Tow cable or disruption.

"Would Fringe Tow Cable help or hurt?"

Neither, i just hope WOTC don't go down that root. Basically what i was saying before.

I said that NR Han could affinity-in 1 droid named R2 or C-3PO, which would avoid the possibility of Han ST and Tow cable being used in conjunction. I also said it was unlikely. If the NR had affinity you are right that it would be for Chewie if anyone.

I feel like this one of the Republic's only shows left. Three factions have Super Stealth (4 including Imperials), and most of the Republic jedi are overshadowed by Sith/Imperial beats. I don't think it should be taken away and given to other factions.

I'd rather see some new ideas for other factions that need help. I think the Seps should have a speed advantage, I mean those huge droids would stomp right through low objects. For a start.