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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 10:53 am 
Master of the Order
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LESHIPPY wrote:
TimmerB123 wrote:
Ysalamiri (yes, just the animal)


I tired to get that through once. it will be interesting to see how you guys flesh it out if it makes it.


My thought is it would have to be an emplacement. You see they had these trees they lived in, and it one of the books Thrawn placed these trees (with a Ysalamiri in it) every so often.

(From Wookieepedia) Ysalamiri sank their claws into the Olbio trees on which they lived and drew nutrients. It was very difficult to remove a ysalamir from its tree without killing it

With emplacement I don't think it could be abused too badly.

or it could be this: Zann Consortium Ysalamiri cage (Still must have emplacement)

(From Wookieepedia) - The ysalamiri cage was found on Zann Consortium Mobile Defense Units. The Consortium used these cages, each of which contained a single ysalamir from Myrkr to make bubbles within the Force, making the areas they contained impossible for users of the Force to access their power. This gave Consortium forces an advantage when encountering Force-sensitive beings.


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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 11:08 am 
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TimmerB123 wrote:
LESHIPPY wrote:
TimmerB123 wrote:
Ysalamiri (yes, just the animal)


I tired to get that through once. it will be interesting to see how you guys flesh it out if it makes it.


My thought is it would have to be an emplacement. You see they had these trees they lived in, and it one of the books Thrawn placed these trees (with a Ysalamiri in it) every so often.

(From Wookieepedia) Ysalamiri sank their claws into the Olbio trees on which they lived and drew nutrients. It was very difficult to remove a ysalamir from its tree without killing it

With emplacement I don't think it could be abused too badly.

or it could be this: Zann Consortium Ysalamiri cage (Still must have emplacement)

(From Wookieepedia) - The ysalamiri cage was found on Zann Consortium Mobile Defense Units. The Consortium used these cages, each of which contained a single ysalamir from Myrkr to make bubbles within the Force, making the areas they contained impossible for users of the Force to access their power. This gave Consortium forces an advantage when encountering Force-sensitive beings.


I was thinking Emplacement would be appropriate as well. I think it usually popped up on any customs I can recall.

With Emplacement it will definitely hinder the pieces flexibility. Do we make it cheap then? Pelleon's pretty cheap. It sounds like it should be inherently weak and easy to kill.

I think the bigger picture thinking is, what kind of impact would that have on the game?

Cost 9
HP 10
DF 10
AT -
DM -
Savage?
Ysalmiri or new modified Ysalmiri-like SA
Emplacement

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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 11:13 am 
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TimmerB123 wrote:
or it could be this: Zann Consortium Ysalamiri cage (Still must have emplacement)

(From Wookieepedia) - The ysalamiri cage was found on Zann Consortium Mobile Defense Units. The Consortium used these cages, each of which contained a single ysalamir from Myrkr to make bubbles within the Force, making the areas they contained impossible for users of the Force to access their power. This gave Consortium forces an advantage when encountering Force-sensitive beings.


This is very interesting. Possibly only able to be on a squad with another character with Zann Consortium. That would really limit their use of them as last second reinforcement additions and make them and a Zann Con pc part of the base squad.

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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 11:22 am 
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Hunt Saboteur - these guys were hired to protect and safely deliver someone with a bounty on their head to a safe destination. They were fast, smart and agile.

19 pts

50 hp
17 def
6 atk
10 dam
Speed 8
Draw Fire
Evade
Agile
Hunt Sabotage (Enemy special abilities with the word "hunter" in it may not be used against any ally adjacent to this character)


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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 11:28 am 
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TimmerB123 wrote:
Hunt Saboteur - these guys were hired to protect and safely deliver someone with a bounty on their head to a safe destination. They were fast, smart and agile.

19 pts

50 hp
17 def
6 atk
10 dam
Speed 8
Draw Fire
Evade
Agile
Hunt Sabotage (Enemy special abilities with the word "hunter" in it may not be used against any ally adjacent to this character)



Sounds pretty cool Tim. Add a cool (meaning OT) Alien Race that we have a mini for and you've got my +1.

I'll also +1 the ZCYC.

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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 11:42 am 
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TimmerB123 wrote:
Hunt Saboteur - these guys were hired to protect and safely deliver someone with a bounty on their head to a safe destination. They were fast, smart and agile.

19 pts

50 hp
17 def
6 atk
10 dam
Speed 8
Draw Fire
Evade
Agile
Hunt Sabotage (Enemy special abilities with the word "hunter" in it may not be used against any ally adjacent to this character)


This is an idea that I could get behind. I am still against a Yalsimari though (sorry Tim). I could possibly seeing it being ok with only ZC but then you could still add that to the Thrawn/Tyber ideas and have a triple bubble. (thrawn, paleon, Yalsimari) and making it cheap would allow tyber and lobot to bring in bubbles for free which I would be against that as well. Maybe it's just an NPE of mine but instant free piece that can nerf lots of squad ideas isn't a good idea IMO.

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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 12:07 pm 
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I actually really like the zaan consortium idea. Good balance for counter force, that one and peace brigade recruiter. Also for that guy, what about him having rapport 1 for peace brigade? Then there is your three point piece? Maybe a negative commander effect?


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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 12:25 pm 
One of the Sith on Malgus' Shuttle
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I think discussing full stat blocks is getting ahead of ourselves, unless the stat block is just to discuss the feasibility of an idea.

We have until the 31st to settle on a name, so there's plenty of time for brainstorming still.

Proposed timeline:
10/12: Launch (yesterday)
10/12-10/19: Brainstorming...
10/19: Form short list (any ideas that someone seconds other than the original person... this list could be quite long, actually)
10/19-10/24: Vote on short list
10/24: Trim to Finalists (say, 5 max?) for final voting
10/24-10/29: Vote on Finalists

Just a proposal on timeline.


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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 1:02 pm 
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sthlrd2 wrote:
TimmerB123 wrote:
Hunt Saboteur - these guys were hired to protect and safely deliver someone with a bounty on their head to a safe destination. They were fast, smart and agile.

19 pts

50 hp
17 def
6 atk
10 dam
Speed 8
Draw Fire
Evade
Agile
Hunt Sabotage (Enemy special abilities with the word "hunter" in it may not be used against any ally adjacent to this character)


This is an idea that I could get behind. I am still against a Yalsimari though (sorry Tim). I could possibly seeing it being ok with only ZC but then you could still add that to the Thrawn/Tyber ideas and have a triple bubble. (thrawn, paleon, Yalsimari) and making it cheap would allow tyber and lobot to bring in bubbles for free which I would be against that as well. Maybe it's just an NPE of mine but instant free piece that can nerf lots of squad ideas isn't a good idea IMO.



Ysalamiri would have to be 11 or more points so Zyber couldn't bribe it and Lobot could only bring in 1. Emplacement keeps it in check.


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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 1:02 pm 
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FlyingArrow wrote:
I think discussing full stat blocks is getting ahead of ourselves, unless the stat block is just to discuss the feasibility of an idea.

We have until the 31st to settle on a name, so there's plenty of time for brainstorming still.

Proposed timeline:
10/12: Launch (yesterday)
10/12-10/19: Brainstorming...
10/19: Form short list (any ideas that someone seconds other than the original person... this list could be quite long, actually)
10/19-10/24: Vote on short list
10/24: Trim to Finalists (say, 5 max?) for final voting
10/24-10/29: Vote on Finalists

Just a proposal on timeline.


+1


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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 2:36 pm 
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TimmerB123 wrote:
Ysalamiri would have to be 11 or more points so Zyber couldn't bribe it and Lobot could only bring in 1. Emplacement keeps it in check.


Yes I would agree with this costing line of thought. One of the factors to be considered on a unit with such potential for abuse.

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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 2:38 pm 
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GeneralGrievous wrote:
I actually really like the zaan consortium idea. Good balance for counter force, that one and peace brigade recruiter. Also for that guy, what about him having rapport 1 for peace brigade? Then there is your three point piece? Maybe a negative commander effect?


I don't think the game needs another 3 point shooter.

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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 3:25 pm 
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TimmerB123 wrote:
FlyingArrow wrote:
I think discussing full stat blocks is getting ahead of ourselves, unless the stat block is just to discuss the feasibility of an idea.

We have until the 31st to settle on a name, so there's plenty of time for brainstorming still.

Proposed timeline:
10/12: Launch (yesterday)
10/12-10/19: Brainstorming...
10/19: Form short list (any ideas that someone seconds other than the original person... this list could be quite long, actually)
10/19-10/24: Vote on short list
10/24: Trim to Finalists (say, 5 max?) for final voting
10/24-10/29: Vote on Finalists

Just a proposal on timeline.


+1


Seems reasonable. Might want to extend the Brainstorming period a bit longer, and shorten the voting periods to only a couple of days each instead of 5 days.

Here's a question for voting, is it open to everyone that isn't an "official V-Set Designer" or will voting be limited to whoever has chimed in on this thread during the brain storming period?

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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 3:41 pm 
One of the Sith on Malgus' Shuttle
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R5Don4 wrote:
I don't think the game needs another 3 point shooter.


The only one we have is a Battle Droid with Gha, but I agree that swarms of 3 point shooters are a bad idea. For that reason, I don't think Rapport for Peace Brigade Thug would work. For a 3-point shooter, there would need to be such a severe handicap that they could only serve as a throw-in for the last few points in a squad, never for offense or anything you would rely on.

Various possible handicaps (tons of other possibilities):
Speed 2
Shell Shock: When activating, this character may not move or attack, save 11.
Friendly Fire: If this character misses an attack, an ally within line of sight takes the damage instead, save 11.
New Recruit: If possible, this character must ends its move adjacent to an allied commander.
Emplacement
Fog of War: When this character moves, an opponent moves this character, save 6.

I want a 3-point piece, and a shooter would be a decent variant, but as far as I'm concerned it could be anything as long as it's playable.


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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 3:44 pm 
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I think the voting on the final two pieces needs to be open to everyone (well, non-designers). It avoids the appearance that a "select few" are calling the shots with these community pieces (obviously that's not the case, but if the point of this experiment is openness, then let's have it be open). It also has the advantage of catching people who didn't hear about the project in advance, but might be interested in contributing ideas later in the design process.


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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 4:03 pm 
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I would expect voting to be open to all non designers. I'm sure there are people out there who just want to help design a piece and they could care less about what piece.

If you only let the small number of people who chimed in on this thread that it would cause problems with people.

And to get back on track. I am against a fringe bubble allowing all shooters getting force immunity. I believe it helps shooters more than anyone and shooters are already so strong and getting stronger (covert opps training) and adding a bubble (espicially cheap) is giving them another big boost. With guns being able to mobile and shoot at 30, 40, or 50 damage shots being force immune is a bad idea. I would rather see a piece that would help melee.
That's why I'm ok with a peace brigade guy (should not have rapport) would help the Vong who are all melee and a faction that needs help anyways.
I will be chiming in on this thread whenever I can and will be voting when that period gets here but I am against a fringe bubble. I'm sure there are ways of balancing it out but that does nothing to convince me of a fringe bubble being created. I adamantly am against a fringe bubble and think we should start talking about other ideas.

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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 4:27 pm 
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UrbanShmi wrote:
I think the voting on the final two pieces needs to be open to everyone (well, non-designers). It avoids the appearance that a "select few" are calling the shots with these community pieces (obviously that's not the case, but if the point of this experiment is openness, then let's have it be open). It also has the advantage of catching people who didn't hear about the project in advance, but might be interested in contributing ideas later in the design process.


This is just my opinion but, let's not exclude anyone where we can possibly help it. I know no matter what anyone does someone might feel left out for whatever reason, no getting around that. Submissions of ideas, anyone welcome before a certain date. Short list, anyone can vote, finals anyone can vote.

We have to decide on a date to cut off submissions so we start voting. Even this essential task is going to exclude people, for the reasons you mentioned, anyone who hadn't heard about it. So that leads us to what will be more open and fair, more time for brain storming or more time for voting? If we establish these dates now, on day 2, we can allow the maximum amount of time for brainstorming/community input and then interested community members will know when they have to vote. National elections are decided (usually, Gore V Bush 2000 notwithstanding) in a day, so it seems a bit much for us to have an extended voting period for limited choices. Let's set the dates now and it will be known to anyone wanting to be involved that this is when we are deciding.

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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 4:49 pm 
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It is open for anyone who is not a designer. Even playtesters.

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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 4:53 pm 
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Yeah, those are two different ideas Don. Have some nifty tricks for both, and a new ability.


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 Post subject: Re: Do you want to make a piece for a v-set?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 13, 2012 5:01 pm 
One of the Sith on Malgus' Shuttle
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R5Don4 wrote:
National elections are decided (usually, Gore V Bush 2000 notwithstanding) in a day, so it seems a bit much for us to have an extended voting period for limited choices. Let's set the dates now and it will be known to anyone wanting to be involved that this is when we are deciding.


I put in a longer voting window so there's time for "campaigning". Think of brainstorming as the petitions to get on the ballot (and you only need 2 signatures on the petition - ha!), then the short list (which may be very long) is the primaries, and the final 5 is the general election. In the real world primaries and the general election, there's time to campaign, and that's what the extended windows were for. Once it's clear what the alternatives are for the later rounds, I think we should have time to talk about that limited pool.

Should we have an actual window of time just for that discussion where the polls are still closed, before the next round of voting starts? 48 hours of voting should be enough time to have the polls open. Anyone who wants to chime in will probably be checking in every 2 days.

Modified proposed timeline:
10/12: Launch (yesterday)
10/12-10/19: Brainstorming...
10/19: Form short list (any ideas that someone seconds other than the original person... this list could be quite long, actually)
10/19-10/22: Discussion of short list
10/22-10/24: Vote on short list
10/24: Trim to Finalists (say, 5 max?) for final voting
10/24-10/27: Discussion of finalists
10/27-10/29: Vote on Finalists


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