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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 12:40 pm 
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Rd 1 I played Lou and it felt like my brain was in slow motion the whole game. Echanis shot up and killed stuff and finally finished off Cad (his final attacker) with about 10 mins or so left in the match.

Rd 2
I played John (the local kid and his Vong). I shoot and shooot and shoot and try and play keep away from his range 12 charging assaults. If he had been a little more aggressive and just run all of his guys in the same direction, he might have been able to win if he had gotten some breaks. As it was, he split his group and I just played keep away and shot for lots of damage. 2-0 (6pts)

Rd 3
Played Gerry and his Pilots. This is a great matchup for me. This is a much better matchup for me than his old Naboo Trooper squad. In theory, every time I shoot one, I hit it (with Atris going I need not 1s to hit) so he has to avoid both shots or be dead. Then on the death shots he needs (8/12s depending on Atris) and I need to fail both evades for him to kill me. And that is if he can even shoot at the echani and there isn't something else in his way. What really happened is that he failed nearly every evade save the first time and then on the death shots was rolling poorly enough that he often either missed entirely or if he did hit, I evaded. The first echani (In an average dice rolling extravaganza, each echani should trade with 2 of the pilots) killed 4 pilots and still had 10 HP left. I did forget that they had speed 8 so he tried to climb back in, but his dice failed him again and again and when he did manage to hit shots they were evaded (or Atris deflected them). Won this game in a blow-out. 3-0 (pts)

Rd 4, the computer tried to pair Lou and I up again (but it told us it was a duplicate pairing like it was supposed to). Since I had also already played the other 6 pt player (gerry), I got paired with the highest 5 pt player and Gerry and Lou got paired up. So I played Tim and his Vong squad. This game was about as sloppy as I have seen either Tim or I play in quite a long time. Tim stole swap and then in one of his first sequences activated the Yammosk. That let me set up my remaining forces quite differently. Then Tim misplaced a guy so I could shoot both his aggressive negotiations guys. Then I forgot that he had swap so let him kill an Echani. Then later, I forgot he hadn't activated a dude yet and didn't swap (letting him kill another echani) when I moved thrawn because I was setting up for next round. In the end Tim's mistakes outweighed mine and he had lobot and the Yammosk left to my Thrawn, Atris (wounded), Veers, Jabba. 4-0 (12 pts).

The final 4 was announced as Myself, Gerry, Jake and Eric. At this point there was some consternation because Gerry professed that he was good for 1 more game, but wasn't sure if he was up for 2 more games (long drive home) and he thought that he had a very, very good matchup against Jake so would need to play 2 more games. My matchup against Eric is a 100% win for me unless I roll all 1s because he has no movement breakers and the maps list that we had. I stay farther than 6 away (and out of sight of HK) which is easy to do with swap and GMA and decimate his squad. So I already knew I was in the finals. I mentioned that if Gerry was the sure win in the semis (which seemed to be the thinking of most everyone there similar to the matchup of Naboo vs Mace), that we might not even need the playoff since my matchup with Gerry is quite good (I had blown him out with him having poor rolls but as I mentioned earlier even with average to good rolls, it is a very, very uphill battle for Gerry). At this point, I stepped aside to use the restroom. When I came back, it seemed to me if that is what Gerry/Jake had decided as everyone was packing up their stuff (and not playing).

Glad everyone had a good time and hope to see people in PA in a few weeks.

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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 5:20 pm 
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TimmerB123 wrote:
It's unfair to the other players still having a chance to compete to just end it (even if they reluctantly agree to it because they don't want someone to die).


Tim, as it happens I must take a certain degree of umbrage with this statement. While clearly I'm the epicenter of why the playoff did not occur, I stated and restated that whatever decision was made regarding the final four, I would abide with that decision.

Also remember that I too had a chance to compete and I personally very much liked my chances, despite my earlier loss to Jason. Of course not finishing didn't feel right as I always look forward to my encounters with Jake. Since we started later than expected I had to voice my concern given the time, as I knew what I facing on the ride home.

The decision IMO wasn't rushed nor was there any intent to and if there was a dissenting opinion, then it should have been vehemently voiced. As you know I am not an unreasonable person.

My foremost concern is that there is no bad blood over this.

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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 5:31 pm 
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DarphNader wrote:
TimmerB123 wrote:
It's unfair to the other players still having a chance to compete to just end it (even if they reluctantly agree to it because they don't want someone to die).


Tim, as it happens I must take a certain degree of umbrage with this statement. While clearly I'm the epicenter of why the playoff did not occur, I stated and restated that whatever decision was made regarding the final four, I would abide with that decision.

Also remember that I too had a chance to compete and I personally very much liked my chances, despite my earlier loss to Jason. Of course not finishing didn't feel right as I always look forward to my encounters with Jake. Since we started later than expected I had to voice my concern given the time, as I knew what I facing on the ride home.

The decision IMO wasn't rushed nor was there any intent to and if there was a dissenting opinion, then it should have been vehemently voiced. As you know I am not an unreasonable person.

My foremost concern is that there is no bad blood over this.


Sincerely I am not mad at you Gerry. This was an eye opener and a learning experience. I just feel that at all future regionals should have a plan in place for this. In the past it has happened that someone has had to go and someone else stepped into their place. I feel that this is the way it should have happened. To my knowledge this is the first regional ever to plan on having a final 4 and not end up doing it. It is a regional, therefore what plan is set at the beginning should be followed through with. If any individual wants to not play, that is their right. But that should not cause a domino effect so that nobody plays. I would have gladly played another round, and I know there were several others that wanted to. I feel the worst for Jake that has made the final 4 for the fourth (or is it fifth?) time, and got his chances to compete for the gold that has thus eluded him taken away from. No other option was presented to him other than play and feel really guilty or not play at all. There were other options that could have been presented.


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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 5:42 pm 
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Fair enough regarding the learning but as this was my 4th final four, walking away with how my squad was goin wasn't sitting all that great with me either.

I too want the coveted gold.

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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 9:34 pm 
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First I must say there is no bad blood with me between anyone. Like I stated many times before, I play this game, but the best part of getting into this game has been all the friends that I have made all over the country.
Friendship does come first and their saftey. That said, it still doesn't mean that I can't feel torn as I do, but there is no bad blood on my part.

@ Tim, this was at least my fifth, but if I remember correctly, then this was my sixth final four. And yes, that championship spot that you have got 8x has eluded me for to long.

But, I was the highest placer to run Caedus, lol. I really thought there was going to be more Caedus squads, its a shame that Bronson and crew couldn't make it, I hope everything is fine on that end.

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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Mon Apr 08, 2013 9:49 pm 
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Bronson said they all got home ok, but it was the worst trip ever.

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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:31 am 
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DarphNader wrote:
Fair enough regarding the learning but as this was my 4th final four, walking away with how my squad was goin wasn't sitting all that great with me either.

I too want the coveted gold.


The huge difference is that you wanted to head home and not play. Jake REALLY wanted to play. You made your choice which is completely fine, unfortunately that made Jake's choice an unfair one.

I don't understand why you didn't just drop or concede. The end result was the same for you, but why not give someone else a chance to compete who wanted to stay?

I think asking someone else to NOT PLAY is unfair. Even bringing it up is unfair. It is your choice whether to play or not - it doesn't involve anyone else. Decide for yourself, then either play or drop. Let others that want to play get a chance to without having to feel guilty about it.


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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 11:06 am 
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TimmerB123 wrote:
DarphNader wrote:
Fair enough regarding the learning but as this was my 4th final four, walking away with how my squad was goin wasn't sitting all that great with me either.

I too want the coveted gold.


The huge difference is that you wanted to head home and not play. Jake REALLY wanted to play. You made your choice which is completely fine, unfortunately that made Jake's choice an unfair one.


^ Incorrect... The huge difference is that I said I was good for one more match at most but I did prefer the expeditious exit. I do fear there is bad blood simmering here, which again is my fault but was never my intent.

I believe I've stated my feelings pretty clearly here and had I known what the day's outcome would been, I would never have made the trip on Saturday. It simply isn't worth the agro I've caused and for that I am truly sorry.

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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 1:17 pm 
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DarphNader wrote:
TimmerB123 wrote:
DarphNader wrote:
Fair enough regarding the learning but as this was my 4th final four, walking away with how my squad was goin wasn't sitting all that great with me either.

I too want the coveted gold.


The huge difference is that you wanted to head home and not play. Jake REALLY wanted to play. You made your choice which is completely fine, unfortunately that made Jake's choice an unfair one.


^ Incorrect... The huge difference is that I said I was good for one more match at most but I did prefer the expeditious exit. I do fear there is bad blood simmering here, which again is my fault but was never my intent.

I believe I've stated my feelings pretty clearly here and had I known what the day's outcome would been, I would never have made the trip on Saturday. It simply isn't worth the agro I've caused and for that I am truly sorry.


Alright - I was incorrect when I said you didn't want to play. I should have said that you made it clear that you would prefer to head home without playing the finals due to the hour and exhaustion. I am 100% positive that there was no malicious intent. I was very glad you did come, it's always great to see you. As far as the finals, what's done is done. I really think this is more about a lesson for how to handle it differently in the future rather than being upset by how it happened this time. I think next time anyone wants to leave early they make that decision for themselves and don't put it out to anyone else. TO's and judges need to make sure this is the case. Each person has every right to play or not play, but that needs to be an individual decision. If someone wants to leave, they tell the TO and someone replaces them. Or at very least someone concedes so their opponent may play the next round for their chance. I have no doubt this option didn't even occur to those involved. This is why I am discussing it - so that in the future people know what course of action to take.

I had a great time at this regional (despite my own poor play in round 4). It's good to see all of you and hang out. Sorry for belaboring the point too much. I am sincerely not upset at any individuals. Lesson learned, let's all move on.


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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 9:22 pm 
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I don't want to hijack this thread and I feel that this part of the discussion should move to a separate thread, but I will state this.

I think we do need to come up for some formal procedure that every TO can follow as it relates to something like this. How we got to this point is not my concern, I wasn't there. I do think that having something in place will help in the future.

Example - While waiting for the top 8 to be decided at Gencon my wife calls and she has been in a wreck and her and my son are in the hospital. I have a good enough record that I would be 7 of the top 8. The 8th and 9th player should move up when I drop. If I would have got the call while playing in the final 8 it is too late and I should just drop and the 9th player would not move in to play in my spot.

If some one cane move this to another thread that would be great.

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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 11:14 pm 
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On a completely different and positive note, I really liked the idea if a triumvirate of judges like they had at MI. The idea was you have three judges, all of which play - one makes most of the calls, unless it is in their own game, then judge 2 makes the call. In the rare case that the 2 judges play each other - that's where judge three comes in.

I like this because I really think we need as many players as we can get to actually play. And there is a specific plan in place for any contingency.

Of course - it does take the RIGHT three people to pull it off. Unbiased, knowledgable, and willing to stay until the end.

I plan on implementing it at Chicago.


Last edited by TimmerB123 on Tue Apr 09, 2013 11:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Tue Apr 09, 2013 11:16 pm 
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And don't forget either fast (or not easily disrupted from their train of thought in game). Would hate to see someone who is judging get interrupted and either forget what they were going to do or make the round take an extremely long time if they are running a squad that takes longer to play.

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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:04 am 
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Agreed.

The judging panel was the best news I heard on Saturday; as it does address the need for engaging the maximum number of players competing for given event.

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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 6:57 am 
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That's a fairly clever solution. It's looking like the Atlanta regional will probably be the only one I'm attending this year, so maybe we'll do that so that I can play instead of just judge.

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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 10:00 am 
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I like this three judge idea. I will look into doing this for Kokomo.

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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 10:10 am 
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Try to make sure the frist judge is a fairly fast player that was the reason Jason thought I should be the frist judge.


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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 10:14 am 
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Actually, I was already planning to do something like this for the Vassal Regional. I am currently the judge, but I'm asking for a couple of other people to step in for any situation that I might be involved in.

It has always seemed unfair to me that the judge wasn't allowed to play. Unfair. Bad. A path to the darkside, it is.

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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 4:01 pm 
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thereisnotry wrote:
Actually, I was already planning to do something like this for the Vassal Regional. I am currently the judge, but I'm asking for a couple of other people to step in for any situation that I might be involved in.

It has always seemed unfair to me that the judge wasn't allowed to play. Unfair. Bad. A path to the darkside, it is.


Assuming I'm off, I will be glad to help.

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 Post subject: Re: MI Regional April 6
PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 9:38 pm 
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TimmerB123 wrote:
On a completely different and positive note, I really liked the idea if a triumvirate of judges like they had at MI. The idea was you have three judges, all of which play - one makes most of the calls, unless it is in their own game, then judge 2 makes the call. In the rare case that the 2 judges play each other - that's where judge three comes in.

I like this because I really think we need as many players as we can get to actually play. And there is a specific plan in place for any contingency.

Of course - it does take the RIGHT three people to pull it off. Unbiased, knowledgable, and willing to stay until the end.

I plan on implementing it at Chicago.


Of course, you know how it would have played out if I had actually been able to make it. ;)

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