SWMGAMERS.com Forums :: View topic - Kokomo 2011 Regional Results

Congrats on the win Tim! And shame on you for using Nute. We all know that he is Over-Powered and a broken fig.

PS.. you forgot Whorm I believe

Won the first game against Chris using his Atris, 3 handmaidens, Veers, Thrawn, Mas, Lobot, filler. I used another Scout and the Blaster-for-hire for reinforcements. This was a cautious game as the Handmaidens can really deal damage. Was content to trade a Scout for a handmaiden at around round 3. I picked off filler with all the shots (they were free but interference for his Lobot in the background). Managed to pick off another handmaiden only losing my free Blaster For Hire (running interference). Then picked off Lobot killing his last door control. Killed the other Handmaiden leaving only his Thrawn, Veers, Atris and Mas. Final score was like 103-24. I felt then (but didn't push it) and even more so now that it should have been a 3 point win. Tim argued that since Atris was left it should be 2 points. Couldn't disagree more, as I had like 20 shots/round left against his 2-10 point/shot shooters and a melee piece. It is almost impossible to kill an Atris that is meant to only hide and spend force points.

Think the 3-2 system can be easily abused and not merely because I disagree with the 2 point game in round 1.

Can't wait to play again soon as we anticipate travelling to Michigan to play in their Regional.

I've never felt like the 60 minute time limit was enough for the typical SWM player to complete a 200 point game which was one of two reasons I opposed moving the championship to 200 points.

So the typical player is going to have to play a bit less cautiously than they prefer. Playing quickly well is a skill as much as anything else in the game. Now it's one that's being rewarded fairly heavily. Players not interested in developing that skill are unfortunately going to suffer a lot of 2 point wins.

I'm not quite sure about your concern with reporting. Generally the score is inconsequential. If the winner's score is anything less than 200, then it qualifies as a 2 point win whether it's 190-180 or 190-10. The lead margin doesn't typically matter. The judgement call would be in cases where the leading player reported that the opponent was playing too slowly to the judge earlier in the game, and the judge felt that the speed of play of one player is what prevented his opponent from being able to get a full victory.

There will of course be judgement calls. If, with 2 minutes left in the game, a player down 190-10 dawdled then retreated his two remaining mouse droids or something I'd probably judge it a 3 point win.

But I see no distinction between, say, 100-95 and 100-25 in regards to getting more than a 2 point win. Neither game is close to completion even though the lead margin is quite different and the eventual winner of the latter game better defined.

Author:	LESHIPPY [ Fri Apr 29, 2011 11:26 am ]
Post subject:	Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
Made you look Actually holding space Players and Squads

Author:	LESHIPPY [ Fri Apr 29, 2011 11:26 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
Player W L Match Points Match Win % Completed Victories H2H Matchups OMW% 1 Tim Ballard 4 0 11 100.0000 3 0 37.5000 2 Jake 3 1 8 75.0000 2 0 62.5000 3 Chris Pulis 3 1 7 75.0000 1 0 37.5000 4 Jason Alvey 3 1 7 75.0000 1 0 37.5000 5 Bryan Hole 2 2 6 50.0000 2 0 50.0000 6 Les Eller 2 2 6 50.0000 2 0 43.7500 7 Dennis Beard 2 2 5 50.0000 1 0 56.2500 8 Mike Giles 2 2 5 50.0000 1 0 56.2500 9 Adam Coe 1 3 3 25.0000 1 0 50.0000 10 Todd Jones 0 1 2 0.0000 0 0 100.0000 11 Rich Dionne 0 4 0 0.0000 0 0 56.2500 12 Stephen Hole 0 2 0 0.0000 0 0 50.0000

Author:	LESHIPPY [ Sat Apr 30, 2011 7:08 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
Winner Tim Ballard. I will have the sqquads posted in a day or two.

Author:	R5Don4 [ Sat Apr 30, 2011 7:35 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
Congrats to Tim. I am sure he can credit his win to having the advantage of waking up at 4:30 in the morning. Make note of that all extreme netdeckers out there, it is also very important to wake up ridiculously early if you want to win Good job again Tim. Can't wait for the write up and the results of how many deer had to die today.

Author:	TimmerB123 [ Sun May 01, 2011 5:35 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
Somehow I made it through, sleep or not. First and foremost: Thanks to Les and Brian and all the other IN guys for hosting! It ran totally smooth, and was a lot of fun. Not a huge turnout, but definitely some quality players. Of what I remember of the top of my head: Tim Ballard - 1st Jake K - 2nd (Vong - Nom, Cad Bane, Lobot, Yammosk, + tons of workers Chris P - 3rd (Imperial - Mitthrawn, Atris, Veers, 3 handmaidens, etc) Jason A - 4th (New Republic - Kyle Combat Instructor, Jacen JK, Ganner, Dash RS, Jag Fel, Ben Skywalker, Dodanna, R7) My Squad: Gunray's Glatiators Darth Sidious IG Lancer Droid Nute Gunray Lobot General Whorm Loathsom IG-86 Assassin Droid (x2) Gha Nackt R7 Astromech Mouse Droid (x3) Map: Rhen Var Citadel Nute's typical reinforcements: Battle Droid Officer and 4 Battle Droids, or sub San Hill for the 4 Battle Droids if they have Dodanna, San or Ozzel. Lobot's typical reinforcements: 6 mouse droids and an Muun Tactics Broker, or 2 treadwell droids and a mouse vs Nom Bombs The squad's strength is adaptability. Pawned Lancer is better without San, but best when you out activate your opponent. So you can bring San when you need him, leave him out when you don't. Up to 27 activations possible without San. Of course I like out-activating, and getting the near auto init form the MTB. You have the "out" from the MTB by pawning him with Sidious (although I have never used it). I typically out-activate, pawn strafe, regular attack and strafe, win init, and strafe again. That's 60 damage to everyone and +20 to one target, WITHOUT TWIN. I typically count on the lancer not having twin until it gets down and dirty. I just safely mow down fodder and put some hits on everyone. Then the IG's start getting into the mix with 120 damage output (180 when you pawn one). Gha repairs, Battle Droids help take care of fodder, hit that last 10 pts off an enemy, or combine fire. Lancer isn't as scary as with Grievous, but having 2 IG-86's to back it up is not messing around. Squads that give it trouble are death shot squads (Mando w/ Jaster Mareel or Republic with Mon Mothma and/or Plo Koon), self destruct squads (Nom Bombs, Kel-Dor BHs) and Riposte or Djem-So. I did face all of these, and it makes for a tough match, you just have to be very careful and meticulously work your way around it. Death Shot squads: Use the IG-86's to shoot, and have a mouse droid in front, so at worst they'll kill a mouse droid. Nom Bombs: 2 treadwell droids (w/ Lobot) help, but you have to take out the big threats. Cad Bane and Nom only have 80 hps each, so that's a strafe and a regular attack to kill either when you have a mouse droid in place. Gladly take the 20 damage to kill either of those two. Risposte and Djem-so you just have to avoid with the lancer. You can take one swat if you have to (you won't have the twin on deep strikes or vs Kyle), but kill everything else you can. IG-86s can take down that nasty Riposter/Djem-Soer. It's almost an auto-win if played right vs squads without one of the above mentioned counters or uber-high activations. I have been told it's one of the most frustrating squads to play against, because it seems to have an answer for everything. I clearly saw that it can be beaten (had a few close matches), but it is no doubt a tough squad. Now it's back to the drawing board to think up new squads.

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Author:	Ruhk [ Sun May 01, 2011 5:54 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
Congrats on the win Tim! And shame on you for using Nute. We all know that he is Over-Powered and a broken fig. PS.. you forgot Whorm I believe

Author:	TimmerB123 [ Sun May 01, 2011 9:56 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
Ruhk wrote: Congrats on the win Tim! And shame on you for using Nute. We all know that he is Over-Powered and a broken fig. PS.. you forgot Whorm I believe Engineer showed me the light on Nute. Although I think he has abandoned him now. Yes I did forget Whorm. Fixed

Author:	LESHIPPY [ Mon May 02, 2011 9:17 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
Update

Author:	LESHIPPY [ Mon May 09, 2011 10:57 am ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
Sorry I have not entered in all the squads yet for this regional. I am dealing with several other things at the moment. One will be obvious soon enough and the other is helping to cordinate relief efforts for a feinds who lost her house during the tornadoes in AL. Sorry this is currently on the back burner.

Author:	WacoBlaze [ Mon May 09, 2011 4:42 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
I used: Mando Captain, Mereel, Mando Scout x4, Gunsmith, R7, Uggie, 6x mouse (198) + depending on the matchup reinforcements of: another Scout + Mando Blaster for Hire, a Quartermaster (when I needed higher rolls on death shots), a Counter-Intelligence Officer + Mando Trooper, or a Mando Bounty Hunter. My map was Bothan Spynet Won the first game against Chris using his Atris, 3 handmaidens, Veers, Thrawn, Mas, Lobot, filler. I used another Scout and the Blaster-for-hire for reinforcements. This was a cautious game as the Handmaidens can really deal damage. Was content to trade a Scout for a handmaiden at around round 3. I picked off filler with all the shots (they were free but interference for his Lobot in the background). Managed to pick off another handmaiden only losing my free Blaster For Hire (running interference). Then picked off Lobot killing his last door control. Killed the other Handmaiden leaving only his Thrawn, Veers, Atris and Mas. Final score was like 103-24. I felt then (but didn't push it) and even more so now that it should have been a 3 point win. Tim argued that since Atris was left it should be 2 points. Couldn't disagree more, as I had like 20 shots/round left against his 2-10 point/shot shooters and a melee piece. It is almost impossible to kill an Atris that is meant to only hide and spend force points. 2nd Game. Played Jason Alvey's NR squad with Dash, Kyle, Ganner, Dodonna, etc. I used the CIO with Trooper. A real dance of a game as Jason needed to Keep Kyle in close proximity to his Dash, etc. to try to disrupt my Death Shots and Twin. I made a real mistake early (didn't read Ben Skywalker's card) and forgot he had Stealth. I set up a double override at the end of the round with four shots to kill him. Did not know that he had stealth...read the darn card!! He gets init. and kills the non-cloaked gunsmith getting an easy 16 points. I then had to press. Very close and low scoring. Alvey gets the 2 point win. I killed Dash and hurt Ben and Ganner a lot but did not kill. He kills a few scouts the gunsmith and it ahead in gambits. 3rd Game. Played Todd with his 71 point Vader giving an extra attack plus Boba BH, Dash several mouse droids and other filler. I managed to pick off Dash early as he was too aggressive and missed all 4 evades. Then I based his Boba while dancing away and around Vader and killed his Boba (also missed most of his evades when he had the chance to evade). Then really worked Vader with my zillion shots and was content to let him roll dark armors and occasional reflects. I used the Quartermaster in the game to help against the high defense of Vader and it really helped. Was over in about 30 minutes for a 3 point win for me. 2-1 5 points. Game 4. Played Jake and his Bomb Vong squad with Cad. Was a really cautious game and was very close the entire game. I had to be careful as he had many bombers as well as Tactics broker to set them off. Went very well pretty early as I had an early kill shot on Lobot from across almost the entire board. He had him opening a door and since he was almost the only one not SS, I got a quick lead. He kept advancing and I had to keep moving away while trying to set up shots on bombers. The game was close and in the last round I made a move that had to pay off to have a chance to win. He had thought that I left a door open with a scout inside. He moved Cad close to the door at the end of the round. When the round began I had the door close and and locked a door behind Cad with a Gunsmith. He had to be careful as activating Cad would have killed him. After a few moves (he killed the gunsmith) I made a move to base Cad with 4 shots @10 damage each with no evade. I missed like 2 of 4 and did 20 damage. Then when he shot and killed the Scout I got the death shots and missed both (can't stand that) but really needed to hit him earlier. Lost like 90-70 in a close 2 point game for him...the winner (Jake) went to the final 4. Was really disappointed that I had not used the Mando Bounty Hunter as he had Flamethrower 20 which would/could have been HUGE. I put him in as a possible reinforcement and then missed/didn't notice how huge he would have been. A fun strategic game. 2-2 5 points felt like it should have been 6 points but it would not have mattered. Think the 3-2 system can be easily abused and not merely because I disagree with the 2 point game in round 1. Grateful to those that came and played. Hopefully next year it will not be so close to the K-Town as we think it did affect the numbers. Thanks to Les for judging and to Brian Hole, Jason, and Dennis for the fun time playing the Royal Rumble to close the night it was a lot of fun. The highlight was Les using Kreia and getting me to roll a 1 with a full health Durge for betrayal and Brian to roll a 1 on her with Cay to also betray. Can't wait to play again soon as we anticipate travelling to Michigan to play in their Regional.

Author:	NickName [ Mon May 09, 2011 5:29 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
WacoBlaze wrote: Won the first game against Chris using his Atris, 3 handmaidens, Veers, Thrawn, Mas, Lobot, filler. I used another Scout and the Blaster-for-hire for reinforcements. This was a cautious game as the Handmaidens can really deal damage. Was content to trade a Scout for a handmaiden at around round 3. I picked off filler with all the shots (they were free but interference for his Lobot in the background). Managed to pick off another handmaiden only losing my free Blaster For Hire (running interference). Then picked off Lobot killing his last door control. Killed the other Handmaiden leaving only his Thrawn, Veers, Atris and Mas. Final score was like 103-24. I felt then (but didn't push it) and even more so now that it should have been a 3 point win. Tim argued that since Atris was left it should be 2 points. Couldn't disagree more, as I had like 20 shots/round left against his 2-10 point/shot shooters and a melee piece. It is almost impossible to kill an Atris that is meant to only hide and spend force points. Sounds like the judge made the correct call. This score wasn't even close to completion, and there's no evidence (from your description) that your opponent was solely responsible for playing so slowly that the game could not be finished. So it's the classic case of both players playing too slowly to have any reasonable chance to complete the game, and that's exactly the situation the 2 point "win" is there for. Quote: Think the 3-2 system can be easily abused and not merely because I disagree with the 2 point game in round 1. There's always going to be some abuse potential. It's less abusive than the old method. And it's mostly doing what it was intended to do: encourage players to play faster, and reward those who actually win games vs those who just play for a draw that will move them forward in the winners bracket.

Author:	WacoBlaze [ Mon May 09, 2011 5:50 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
Nickname, I understand what you are saying. Chris played a fine game and neither of us played super slow. I am just saying that a game that is 40-30 should be a 2 point win, while a game that is obviously not as close would seem more like a 3 pointer. I know that there has to a be a single system and the 3-2 works well...I agree it does most of the time, I am more concerned about how a game is reported. I think the score total MUST be given for both players and then the 3 or 2 assigned and the judge should be free to talk with only the reporting player without other intereference. Les who was judging did a great job as always. It is more about the system that I was wondering and not the ruling. Again, I lost my game trying to go to 3-1 so that is what really mattered here. You think the 1 hour time limit is sufficient?

Author:	NickName [ Mon May 09, 2011 6:08 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
I've never felt like the 60 minute time limit was enough for the typical SWM player to complete a 200 point game which was one of two reasons I opposed moving the championship to 200 points. So the typical player is going to have to play a bit less cautiously than they prefer. Playing quickly well is a skill as much as anything else in the game. Now it's one that's being rewarded fairly heavily. Players not interested in developing that skill are unfortunately going to suffer a lot of 2 point wins. I'm not quite sure about your concern with reporting. Generally the score is inconsequential. If the winner's score is anything less than 200, then it qualifies as a 2 point win whether it's 190-180 or 190-10. The lead margin doesn't typically matter. The judgement call would be in cases where the leading player reported that the opponent was playing too slowly to the judge earlier in the game, and the judge felt that the speed of play of one player is what prevented his opponent from being able to get a full victory. There will of course be judgement calls. If, with 2 minutes left in the game, a player down 190-10 dawdled then retreated his two remaining mouse droids or something I'd probably judge it a 3 point win. But I see no distinction between, say, 100-95 and 100-25 in regards to getting more than a 2 point win. Neither game is close to completion even though the lead margin is quite different and the eventual winner of the latter game better defined.

Author:	WacoBlaze [ Mon May 09, 2011 6:22 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
Generally the score is inconsequential. If the winner's score is anything less than 200, then it qualifies as a 2 point win whether it's 190-180 or 190-10. The lead margin doesn't typically matter. I am glad to read that, I will be sure to remember that. I will PM you more about what I mean.

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Author:	LESHIPPY [ Mon May 09, 2011 6:35 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
WacoBlaze wrote: Can't wait to play again soon as we anticipate travelling to Michigan to play in their Regional. Please remeber to take Engineer's blue extension cord with you so he can have it for the laminator.

Author:	The_Celestial_Warrior [ Mon Jun 06, 2011 6:33 pm ]
Post subject:	Re: Kokomo 2011 Regional Results
NickName wrote: I've never felt like the 60 minute time limit was enough for the typical SWM player to complete a 200 point game which was one of two reasons I opposed moving the championship to 200 points. So the typical player is going to have to play a bit less cautiously than they prefer. Playing quickly well is a skill as much as anything else in the game. Now it's one that's being rewarded fairly heavily. Players not interested in developing that skill are unfortunately going to suffer a lot of 2 point wins. I'm not quite sure about your concern with reporting. Generally the score is inconsequential. If the winner's score is anything less than 200, then it qualifies as a 2 point win whether it's 190-180 or 190-10. The lead margin doesn't typically matter. The judgement call would be in cases where the leading player reported that the opponent was playing too slowly to the judge earlier in the game, and the judge felt that the speed of play of one player is what prevented his opponent from being able to get a full victory. There will of course be judgement calls. If, with 2 minutes left in the game, a player down 190-10 dawdled then retreated his two remaining mouse droids or something I'd probably judge it a 3 point win. But I see no distinction between, say, 100-95 and 100-25 in regards to getting more than a 2 point win. Neither game is close to completion even though the lead margin is quite different and the eventual winner of the latter game better defined. After Michigan I am becoming more and more of this party...