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 Post subject: Clone Strike 2008
PostPosted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 2:06 pm 
General
General

Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 11:15 pm
Posts: 482
Location: Redmond, WA
If Clone Strike were released today, what would the stats look like? I decided to try to figure it out. This is really just something I did for fun, and I realize I made some pieces a whole lot better than they used to be.

My guidelines were simple:

  • Keep the costs the same.
  • Keep the spirit of the original piece.
  • Try to make every single piece be competitive for its point cost in the modern day SWM environment.
  • Try not to make any piece too good for its cost.
  • Only remove abilities if they are being replaced by something similar.

This is what I came up with. My additions are in [square brackets], the original stats and abilities are in (parentheses).

Please feel free to critique my suggestions, and offer your own.

Aayla Secura (27)
Hit Points: 80
Defense: 19 (18)
Attack: +14 (+11)
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Bodyguard
Melee Attack
[Double Attack]

Force Powers:
[Force 2] (Force 3)
[Force Renewal 1]
[Force Bubble]
Lightsaber Deflect

Commander Effect:
[Adjacent followers with Order 66 gain +8 Attack.]
(Adjacent trooper followers gain +2 Attack.)

Notes: She needed a little boost in her stats. Most Jedi should have Double Attack. Force Bubble seemed like it would have great synergy with Bodyguard and her CE. Granting +2 Attack won't cut it anymore. +8 is substantial enough to actually use.

---

Aerial Clone Trooper Captain (23)
Hit Points: 60 (40)
Defense: 14
Attack: +10
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Flight
Spotter +20
[Mobile Attack]
Order 66

Commander Effect:
At the end of this character's turn, 1 non-Unique follower within 6 squares can make an immediate attack.

Notes: 40 HP on a 23 pt piece is way too low. Mobile Attack adds a little more survivability.

---

Anakin Skywalker (25)
Hit Points: 100 (70)
Defense: 18
Attack: +10 (+8)
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
[Twin Attack] (Double Attack)
Impulsive Sweep
Melee Attack

Force Powers:
Force 4
[Sith Rage] (Lightsaber Precision)
[Lightsaber Assault]
Lightsaber Riposte

Notes: Anakin needed some work. Two lightsabers should be Twin Attack rather than Double, I think. Twin Assaults/Sweeps should be great. Sith Rage makes sense for Anakin at this stage (against the Sandpeople or Dooku, for instance).

---

ARC Trooper (18)
Hit Points: 40
Defense: 18 (16)
Attack: +10
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Order 66
[Evade]
Grenades 10
[Mobile Attack]
[Opportunist]

Notes: I wanted to make these guys tougher to kill and able to put out some more damage.

---

Captain Typho (18)
Hit Points: 60
Defense: 17
Attack: +8
Damage: 20 (10)

Special Abilities:
Unique
Bodyguard

Commander Effect:
[Non-Unique Republic allies within 6 squares gain Bodyguard.]
(Allied Naboo Soldiers gain Bodyguard.)

Notes: 10 damage shooters don't really get much play. His CE was decent, but I hate to see just one piece get boosted by a CE.

---

Clone Trooper (9)
Hit Points: 20 (10)
Defense: 17 (13)
Attack: +7 (+6)
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Order 66

Notes: Clone Troopers needed some help in the stats department.

---

Clone Trooper Commander (13)
Hit Points: 30
Defense: 17 (14)
Attack: +10
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Order 66

Commander Effect:
[Followers within 6 squares with Order 66 gain Careful Shot +3.]
(Trooper followers within 6 squares get +3 Attack if they do not move this turn.)

Notes: Increased defense and changed CE to a named ability so it would stack.

---

Clone Trooper Grenadier (9)
Hit Points: 20 (10)
Defense: 17 (13)
Attack: +6
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Order 66
Grenades 10
[Satchel Charge]

Notes: Better stats and Satchel Charge give the Grenadiers some more utility.

---

Clone Trooper Sergeant (10)
Hit Points: 30 (20)
Defense: 17 (14)
Attack: +10
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Order 66

Commander Effect:
[Followers within 6 squares with Order 66 gain Deadly Attack.]
(Trooper followers within 6 squares score critical hits on attack rolls of natural 19 or 20.)

Notes: Increased HP and Defense and changed his CE to a named ability (also updated from Troopers to Order 66).

---

Agen Kolar (29)
Hit Points: 120
Defense: 19
Attack: +13
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Melee Attack
[Double Attack]

Force Powers:
Force 4
Lightsaber Block
Lightsaber Deflect
[Recovery 40 (Force 1, replaces turn: Remove 40 damage from this character)] (Recovery 20)

Notes: Agen Kolar needed Double Attack. Also, Recovery 20 is a waste of a turn, so I upgraded it to Recovery 40.

---

General Kenobi (36)
Hit Points: 120 (100)
Defense: 20 (19)
Attack: +14
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Double Attack
Melee Attack

Force Powers:
Force 5
Force Heal 20
Lightsaber Deflect

Commander Effect:
Followers can move 2 extra squares on their turns as part of their move.

Notes: General Kenobi is solid. He just needed a little more HP and Defense to be totally worth his points.

---

Gungan Cavalry on Kaadu (18)
Hit Points: 50
Defense: 15
Attack: +8 (+4)
Damage: 20 (10)

Special Abilities:
Galloping Attack
Melee Attack
[Self-Destruct 40]

Notes: If you're going to get attacks of opportunity a lot while trying to do Galloping Attack, you might as well actually hit with your attacks and detonate your bag full of boomers when you die. :)

---

Gungan Infantry (9)
Hit Points: 30
Defense: 14
Attack: +4
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
[Grenades 30] (Grenades 10)
Melee Attack
[Self-Destruct 30]

Notes: Grenades 10 won't cut it anymore. I also like the idea of Gungans blowing themselves up when they die...

---

Jedi Guardian (11)
Hit Points: 50 (40)
Defense: 17 (15)
Attack: +9 (+6)
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Melee Attack

Force Powers:
Force 2
Lightsaber Sweep

Notes: Cheap melee grunts are hard to make decent. But with some simple stat increases, I think this guy would make a worthy addition to a Republic squad.

---

Ki-Adi-Mundi (24)
Hit Points: 90
Defense: 18
Attack: +10
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Melee Attack

Force Powers:
Force 3
Anticipation

Commander Effect:
[At the end of this character's turn, 1 adjacent Republic follower may take an immediate turn, which does not count as one of your 2 activations this phase.]
(At the end of this character's turn, you may activate 1 adjacent follower who has not yet activated this round. This does not count as one of your 2 activations this phase.)

Notes: Ki-Adi-Mundi goes from unplayable novelty to uber-competitive piece with one little change to his CE. Instead of just activating an adjacent follower, he gives them a whole extra turn (like Dominate or Pawn of the Dark Side). I limited it to Republic pieces so it wouldn't just be used with Boba BH.

---

Kit Fisto (32)
Hit Points: 120
Defense: 20
Attack: +13
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Melee Attack
[Double Attack]

Force Powers:
Force 4
[Lightsaber Deflect]
Lightsaber Precision
Lightsaber Sweep

Commander Effect:
Non-Unique followers within 6 squares get +4 Attack against wounded enemies.

Notes: Kit Fisto is borderline competitive already. Double Attack and a defensive Force power push him into very attractive squad building territory.

---

Luminara Unduli (30)
Hit Points: 110 (100)
Defense: 19 (18)
Attack: +12
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Double Attack
Melee Attack
[Synergy (+4 Attack when within 6 squares of Barriss Offee)]

Force Powers:
[Force 2] (Force 3)
[Force Renewal 1]
[Lightsaber Deflect]
Lightsaber Sweep
Master Speed

Notes: Luminara's Master Speed and Double Attack already put her above most CS Jedi (which isn't necessarily saying much). She goes down quickly though with low HP, Defense, and no defensive Force powers. I remedied that a bit and added some more incentive to play her with Barriss.

---

Mace Windu (63)
Hit Points: 150
Defense: 22
Attack: +16
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Melee Attack
Triple Attack
Vaapad-Style Fighting

Force Powers:
[Force 2] (Force 5)
[Force Renewal 1]
Lightsaber Block
[Lightsaber Deflect]
Lightsaber Precision
[Master of the Force 2]

Notes: This is the best follower Mace already, but he's kind of lacking for a 63 point piece. Adjusting his Force powers to a more modern set up should boost him a lot.

---

Naboo Soldier (5)
Hit Points: 10
Defense: 13
Attack: +3
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Sniper

Notes: The only change I'd make these guys is to change their rarity from UC to C. :)

---

Padme Amidala (15)
Hit Points: 60
Defense: 17
Attack: +9
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Unique
Double Attack
[Advantageous Attack]
[Greater Mobile Attack]

Commander Effect:
Adjacent followers gain Bodyguard.

Notes: I'm not a big fan of her CE, but it seems like it's still being used in the most recent sets, so I shouldn't change it. Shooters that only do 10 damage just don't cut it anymore, so I added Advantageous Attack for the chance of 20 damage. Greater Mobile means she won't just be a sitting duck.

---

Plo Koon (28)
Hit Points: 110
Defense: 19
Attack: +13
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Melee Attack

Force Powers:
[Force 2] (Force 4)
[Force Renewal 1]
Force Strike
[Lightsaber Deflect]
Lightsaber Precision

Notes: Upgraded his Force points and gave him Deflect so he can deal with shooters. I don't think Plo needs Double Attack because he has Force Strike and Lightsaber Precision.

---

Qui-Gon Jinn (40)
Hit Points: 110
Defense: 20
Attack: +15
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Melee Attack
Double Attack
[Mighty Swing]

Force Powers:
[Force 2] (Force 5)
[Force Renewal 1]
Force Absorb
Lightsaber Block
Surprise Move

Notes: A 40 point Jedi needs to be able to do more than 40 points of damage on a turn. Cunning/Opportunist didn't seem right on Qui-Gon, so I gave him Mighty Swing. Upgrading his Force points allow him to use Surprise Move every round if he wants to (or to use Force Absorb more often). Surprise Move and Mighty Double Attack should be a good combo.

---

Quinlan Vos (26)
Hit Points: 150 (100)
Defense: 18
Attack: +13
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Double Attack
[Charging Assault +10]
Impulsive Savagery
Melee Attack
[Stealth]

Force Powers:
Force 3
Lightsaber Sweep

Notes: How do you make a 26 point Jedi that's worth playing over a JWM? I don't want to take away Impulsive Savagery, so I softened the blow with Charging Assault +10. Stealth and a ton of HP make up for his low Defense and lack of defensive Force powers.

---

Saesee Tiin (26)
Hit Points: 100
Defense: 20
Attack: +13
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Cunning Attack
Melee Attack
Stealth

Force Powers:
[Force 4] (Force 2)
[Lightsaber Assault]
Lightsaber Block

Notes: I upped his Force points and gave him Assault so he can attack twice with Cunning.

---

Yoda (55)
Hit Points: 140
Defense: 22
Attack: +15
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
[Twin Attack] (Double Attack)
Flurry Attack
Melee Attack

Force Powers:
Force 3
Force Defense
[Force Renewal 2] (Force Renewal 1)
Lightsaber Reflect
Master of the Force 3

Commander Effect:
Followers within 6 squares may reroll each failed save once.

Notes: Ideally I'd decrease his cost, but that's against my rules. Instead I upped his Renewal and gave him Twin instead of Double. The extra mobility and fast attacks provided by Twin seem more Yoda-like.

---

Asajj Ventress (34)
Hit Points: 100
Defense: 20
Attack: +12
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Double Attack
Loner
Melee Attack
[Deceptive]
[Stealth]

Force Powers:
Force 2
Lightsaber Riposte

Commander Effect:
[Followers gain Deadly Attack.]
(Followers within 6 squares score critical hits on attack rolls of natural 19 or 20.)

Notes: Loner combined with Deceptive and Stealth make Asajj into a nice assassin. Deceptive Ripostes seem like fun too. I removed the range limit on her CE so she can fully utilize Loner now.

---

Battle Droid (4)
Hit Points: 10
Defense: 11 (9)
Attack: +0
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Droid

Notes: I'm not sure 11 defense will be way harder to hit than 9, but it can't hurt.

---

Battle Droid Officer (9)
Hit Points: 20
Defense: 13
Attack: +0
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Droid
(Fire Control)

Commander Effect:
[Droids are subject to this effect: Non-Unique Droid allies get +4 Attack.]

Notes: Although it pains me to do it, I changed Fire Control into a Commander Effect.

---

Battle Droid on STAP (16)
Hit Points: 30 (10)
Defense: 12 (10)
Attack: +4 (+1)
Damage: 30

Special Abilities:
Droid
Flight
Strafe Attack
[Speed 10]
[Self-Destruct 10]

Notes: I'm not sure if all my changes are enough to make this a good piece...

---

Count Dooku (52)
Hit Points: 130
Defense: 21
Attack: +16
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
[Triple Attack] (Double Attack)
Lightsaber Duelist
Melee Attack

Force Powers:
[Force 3] (Force 5)
[Force Renewal 1]
Lightsaber Block
[Lightsaber Deflect]
Lightsaber Precision
Sith Lightning 30

Notes: More attacks, more Force points, defense against shooters.

---

Dark Side Acolyte (16)
Hit Points: 50
Defense: 17
Attack: +8 (+5)
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
[Twin Attack] (Double Attack)
Melee Attack

Force Powers:
Force 2

Notes: I've never seen one these girls survive long enough to Double Attack. Twin changes the whole piece quite a bit. +5 Attack on a melee piece was atrocious.

---

Darth Maul (55)
Hit Points: 140
Defense: 21
Attack: +14
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Deadly Attack
Melee Attack
Rolling Cleave
Triple Attack
[Crowd Fighting]
[Stealth]

Force Powers:
[Force 4] (Force 3)
[Lightsaber Assault]
Sith Rage

Notes: Stealth is the main change, and the one that I think makes this Maul suddenly worth 55 points.

---

Darth Sidious (36)
Hit Points: 130
Defense: 19
Attack: +0
Damage: 0

Special Abilities:
Unique
Dark Master

Force Powers:
Force 2
Force Renewal 1
Pawn of the Dark Side
Sith Lightning 30

Commander Effect:
[Followers within 6 squares gain Flurry Attack.]
(Each non-Unique follower within 6 squares who scores a critical hit may make an immediate extra attack.)

Notes: Sidious is pretty great already, but his CE was terrible. He should be commanding his Unique apprentices, not just non-Unique scrubs.

---

Destroyer Droid (30)
Hit Points: 40
Defense: 16
Attack: +8
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Droid
[Twin Attack] (Double Attack)
[Shields 3] (Shields 2)
Wheel Form

Notes: Twin Attack is the new Double Attack. Shields 3 offers some more survivability. These will work great with Grievous SC now.

---

Durge (39)
Hit Points: 120 (100)
Defense: 19
Attack: +11 (+10)
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Flight
Bounty Hunter +4
Double Attack
[Regeneration 20] (Regeneration 10)
[Mobile Attack]

Commander Effect:
[Droids are subject to this effect:] Non-Unique followers who end their move within 6 squares of this character gain Momentum.

Notes: Durge is a pretty disappointing piece. He should be way harder to kill. Also, his CE should affect Droids. Mobile Attack gives Durge the option of staying safer, but forgoing the benefits of Double Attack and Regeneration 20.

---

Dwarf Spider Droid (15)
Hit Points: 40 (30)
Defense: 15
Attack: +6
Damage: 30

Special Abilities:
Droid

Notes: These are really pretty good for 15 points. 40 HP means that they can't get picked off with one shot so easily

---

General Grievous (44)
Hit Points: 100
Defense: 20
Attack: +12
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Cyborg
Double Attack
[Accurate Shot]
[Lightsaber]

Force Powers:
Force 1

Commander Effect:
Droids are subject to this effect: Non-Unique Droid followers within 6 squares gain [Extra Attack] (Double Attack).

Notes: His stats still arent great, but Accurate Shot makes him a decent shooter. Lightsaber makes him more of a threat in close range. I upgraded his CE to give Extra Attack instead of just Double, so he can benefit droids who already have Double or Triple Attack.

---

Geonosian Drone (3)
Hit Points: 10
Defense: 12
Attack: +1
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Melee Attack
[Flight]
[Gregarious]

Notes: Just trying to give a reason to play Geonosian Drones over Ewoks. Gregarious and Flight are enough of a reason for me.

---

Geonosian Overseer (16)
Hit Points: 20
Defense: 16
Attack: +4
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Flight
Melee Attack
Droid Master

Notes: I think this guy is pretty good as-is.

---

Geonosian Picador on Orray (13)
Hit Points: 50
Defense: 16
Attack: +7 (+5)
Damage: 20 (10)

Special Abilities:
Melee Attack
Vicious Attack
[Empathy]
[Momentum]
[Paralysis]

Notes: Here's a piece that needed a lot of help.

---

Geonosian Soldier (9)
Hit Points: 20
Defense: 15
Attack: +5 (+2)
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Flight
Sonic Attack
[Gregarious]

Notes: Gregarious and a bit more Attack are enough to make the Geonosian Soldier a nice little grunt for the Seps.

---

Jango Fett (47)
Hit Points: 120
Defense: 19
Attack: +13
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Flight
[Bounty Hunter +6] (Bounty Hunter +4)
[Twin Attack] (Double Attack)
[Sniper]

Notes: Poor Jango has always been in his son's shadow. Still no Accurate Shot, but upgrading Double to Twin should make a huge difference.

---

Security Battle Droid (8)
Hit Points: 20
Defense: 13
Attack: +3
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Droid
Cunning Attack
[It's a Trap!]

Notes: It's a Trap! seems to be the ability of choice for Security Officers in the Empire and on Corellia--why not for Security Battle Droids too?

---

Super Battle Droid (10)
Hit Points: 20
Defense: 16 (12)
Attack: +6 (+2)
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Droid
Charging Fire
Synchronized Fire

Notes: Low defense is what makes Droids unplayable.

---

Aqualish Spy (11)
Hit Points: 40
Defense: 16
Attack: +6
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Spotter +10
[Flanking Support]

Notes: I was tempted to give this guy Stealth, but I think he'd be way overpowered that way.

---

Aurra Sing (37)
Hit Points: 100 (130)
Defense: 20 (21)
Attack: +11
Damage: 10 (20)

Special Abilities:
Unique
Accurate Shot
Careful Shot +4
Jedi Hunter
[Lightsaber]

Force Powers:
Force 2
(Lightsaber Sweep)

Notes: I don't know what the developers were thinking when they made Aurra, but she was way too good. I reduced most of her stats and gave her Lightsaber instead of Lightsaber Sweep.

---

Devaronian Bounty Hunter (12)
Hit Points: 50 (30)
Defense: 15
Attack: +5
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Bounty Hunter +4
[Twin Attack] (Double Attack)

Notes: I'm not sure what it would take to make a Fringe shooter worth 12 points (without making another Kel Dor Bounty Hunter). I feel bad changing Double to Twin again, but Double Attacking shooters are just not great in today's game.

---

Gran Raider (4)
Hit Points: 10
Defense: 13
Attack: +2
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Melee Attack
Mobile Attack
Stealth

Notes: No changes necessary.

---

Ishi Tib Scout (14)
Hit Points: 30
Defense: 15
Attack: +6
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
[Twin Attack] (Double Attack)
Evade
[Mobile Attack]

Notes: I'd play these for 14 points now.

---

Klatooinian Enforcer (7)
Hit Points: 20
Defense: 13
Attack: +6 (+1)
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Advantageous Attack

Notes: Terrible, terrible piece. At least with my change it might hit something. I'm afraid I can't add much more for a 7 point Fringe piece.

---

Nikto Soldier (5)
Hit Points: 10
Defense: 14
Attack: +4 (+2)
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Sniper

Notes: A little more Attack goes a long way.

---

Quarren Raider (13)
Hit Points: 40
Defense: 15
Attack: +7 (+4)
Damage: 20 (10)

Special Abilities:
Charging Fire
Deadeye
Stealth

Notes: I kind of like these guys, but they just didn't have enough damage output for 13 points.

---

Rodian Mercenary (9)
Hit Points: 20
Defense: 16
Attack: +4
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
(Double Attack)
Mercenary
[Careful Shot +4]
[Opportunist]

Notes: Get rid of Double Attack so Nym is a little more useful. Careful Shot synergizes with Mercenary. Opportunist has some precedent on Rodians, and makes this a decent piece.

---

Weequay Mercenary (5)
Hit Points: 10
Defense: 17 (13)
Attack: +8 (+5)
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
(Double Attack)
Melee Attack
Mercenary

Notes: A big stat boost still might not be enough to offset Melee Attack and Mercenary on a 10 HP piece.

---

Wookiee Commando (9)
Hit Points: 40
Defense: 14
Attack: +6
Damage: 20 (10)

Special Abilities:
Melee Attack
Momentum
Quick Reactions

Notes: 20 base damage makes a big difference (and makes Quick Reactions worth more). They lose synergy with the Ithorian Commander, but I think it's worth it.

---

Zam Wesell (45)
Hit Points: 90
Defense: 19
Attack: +12
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Bounty Hunter +4
Kouhun Infestation
Loner
Stealth
[Accurate Shot]
[Deceptive]
[Pilot]

Notes: A high-cost, single attack shooter really needs Accurate Shot to be worth it at all. Deceptive increases her damage output a bit.


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 Post subject: Re: Clone Strike 2008
PostPosted: Tue Apr 29, 2008 10:29 pm 
Really Cool Alien from a Cantina
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Joined: Sun Sep 02, 2007 11:58 pm
Posts: 196
Location: Avoiding Order 66
dude... two more sets and I think you may have a foundation for gvl 3.0 using only the first 4 released sets.

nice work again.

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Strike 2008
PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:30 am 
One of The Ones
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Not bad overall. Once again it's power-ups across the board, which I agree CS figures needed moreso than RS, because it's so heavy melee.

I'm not a fan of replacing Double with Twin, though. They are NOT the same thing.

Just curious: did you playtest these changes? Most of them seem balanced with where the game is now, but I am wondering. (Aayla is one that springs to mind, especially since you turned Clone Troopers into powerhouses for their cost, and THEN also created a powerful CE for them.)

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Strike 2008
PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 4:03 am 
One of The Ones
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I'm skipping over the ones I liked, so please don't take this as all criticism. Since I have nothing to offer on most, I just ignored them. ;)

shinja wrote:
Please feel free to critique my suggestions, and offer your own.

Aayla Secura (27)
Hit Points: 80
Defense: 19 (18)
Attack: +14 (+11)
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Bodyguard
Melee Attack
[Double Attack]

Force Powers:
[Force 2] (Force 3)
[Force Renewal 1]
[Force Bubble]
Lightsaber Deflect

Commander Effect:
[Adjacent followers with Order 66 gain +8 Attack.]
(Adjacent trooper followers gain +2 Attack.)

Notes: She needed a little boost in her stats. Most Jedi should have Double Attack. Force Bubble seemed like it would have great synergy with Bodyguard and her CE. Granting +2 Attack won't cut it anymore. +8 is substantial enough to actually use.


This looks interesting, and I agree with the reasoning, until I see this:

Quote:
Clone Trooper (9)
Hit Points: 20 (10)
Defense: 17 (13)
Attack: +7 (+6)
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Order 66

Notes: Clone Troopers needed some help in the stats department.


So you just turned them into heavy defense, +15 shooters while adjacent to Aayla? And that's just Clone Troopers. Wow.
I think when the game was designed, Clone Troopers were balanced against Battle Droids. You've done away with that concept here, IMO. I would probably reduce the CE to a +4 Attack bonus, or a +3 Attack and +3 Defense. Of course, I would also leave the defense at 13, but that's just me. Maybe if you gave Aayla Force Valor so she could be a follower in some squads.

Quote:
ARC Trooper (18)
Hit Points: 40
Defense: 18 (16)
Attack: +10
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Order 66
[Evade]
Grenades 10
[Mobile Attack]
[Opportunist]

Notes: I wanted to make these guys tougher to kill and able to put out some more damage.


Another example, this time of a character that could get up to +22 Attack. That would just be nuts.

Quote:
Captain Typho (18)
Hit Points: 60
Defense: 17
Attack: +8
Damage: 20 (10)

Special Abilities:
Unique
Bodyguard

Commander Effect:
[Non-Unique Republic allies within 6 squares gain Bodyguard.]
(Allied Naboo Soldiers gain Bodyguard.)

Notes: 10 damage shooters don't really get much play. His CE was decent, but I hate to see just one piece get boosted by a CE.


Death of theme. Sigh.

Quote:
Agen Kolar (29)
Hit Points: 120
Defense: 19
Attack: +13
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Melee Attack
[Double Attack]

Force Powers:
Force 4
Lightsaber Block
Lightsaber Deflect
[Recovery 40 (Force 1, replaces turn: Remove 40 damage from this character)] (Recovery 20)

Notes: Agen Kolar needed Double Attack. Also, Recovery 20 is a waste of a turn, so I upgraded it to Recovery 40.


I would have gone with Regeneration 40 instead. It's silly to me that it's a Force power that prevents you from moving or doing, well, anything.

Quote:
Mace Windu (63)
Hit Points: 150
Defense: 22
Attack: +16
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Melee Attack
Triple Attack
Vaapad-Style Fighting

Force Powers:
[Force 2] (Force 5)
[Force Renewal 1]
Lightsaber Block
[Lightsaber Deflect]
Lightsaber Precision
[Master of the Force 2]

Notes: This is the best follower Mace already, but he's kind of lacking for a 63 point piece. Adjusting his Force powers to a more modern set up should boost him a lot.


Windu needs the following: Greater Mobile Attack; Use the Force; Vicious Attack; Lightsaber Assault

Then he would be worth the points.

Quote:
Yoda (55)
Hit Points: 140
Defense: 22
Attack: +15
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
[Twin Attack] (Double Attack)
Flurry Attack
Melee Attack

Force Powers:
Force 3
Force Defense
[Force Renewal 2] (Force Renewal 1)
Lightsaber Reflect
Master of the Force 3

Commander Effect:
Followers within 6 squares may reroll each failed save once.

Notes: Ideally I'd decrease his cost, but that's against my rules. Instead I upped his Renewal and gave him Twin instead of Double. The extra mobility and fast attacks provided by Twin seem more Yoda-like.


Ugh. So you took away his ability to strike twice and replaced it with something where he can attack twice some of the time against enemies with more than 40 HP. Here's my suggestion:

Yoda 55 pts.
140 HP
22 Defense
+12 Attack
20 Damage

Special Abilities - Unique; Melee Attack. Momentum +4; Twin Attack; Mobile Attack; Flurry Attack

Force Powers
Force 3. Force Renewal 1; Force Defense; Force Leap; Lightsaber Assault; Lightsaber Riposte; Lightsaber Reflect; Use the Force; Master of the Force 3

Commander Effect: Followers within 6 squares can reroll saves once per turn.

Now Flurry is something to be feared. I also removed the word "failed" from his CE. It's more interesting with things like Dominate that way.

Quote:
Battle Droid (4)
Hit Points: 10
Defense: 11 (9)
Attack: +0
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Droid

Notes: I'm not sure 11 defense will be way harder to hit than 9, but it can't hurt.


Spotter 10 and 12 Defense, and these guys would be fine.

Quote:
Battle Droid Officer (9)
Hit Points: 20
Defense: 13
Attack: +0
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Droid
(Fire Control)

Commander Effect:
[Droids are subject to this effect: Non-Unique Droid allies get +4 Attack.]

Notes: Although it pains me to do it, I changed Fire Control into a Commander Effect.


No, no, no, and no. Just ... no. In an age of Disruptive, Fire Control is key. Give the BDO +4 Attack and leave Fire Control (since originally the BDO was supposed to have that +4 bonus, back when a character counted as its own ally). The HP could use a boost too. The ability to garner a really high attack bonus is about all the Droid faction has going for it anymore. This change takes that away from them.

Well those are my suggestions.

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Strike 2008
PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 6:54 am 
Sith Infiltrator
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All great stats, save for...

shinja wrote:
Asajj Ventress (34)
Hit Points: 100
Defense: 20
Attack: +12
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Double Attack
Loner
Melee Attack
[Deceptive]
[Stealth]

Force Powers:
Force 2
Lightsaber Riposte



How the heck did you NOT give her twin and double?

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Strike 2008
PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:12 pm 
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Grand Moff Boris wrote:
I'm skipping over the ones I liked, so please don't take this as all criticism. Since I have nothing to offer on most, I just ignored them. ;)

shinja wrote:
Please feel free to critique my suggestions, and offer your own.

Aayla Secura (27)
Hit Points: 80
Defense: 19 (18)
Attack: +14 (+11)
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Bodyguard
Melee Attack
[Double Attack]

Force Powers:
[Force 2] (Force 3)
[Force Renewal 1]
[Force Bubble]
Lightsaber Deflect

Commander Effect:
[Adjacent followers with Order 66 gain +8 Attack.]
(Adjacent trooper followers gain +2 Attack.)

Notes: She needed a little boost in her stats. Most Jedi should have Double Attack. Force Bubble seemed like it would have great synergy with Bodyguard and her CE. Granting +2 Attack won't cut it anymore. +8 is substantial enough to actually use.


This looks interesting, and I agree with the reasoning, until I see this:

Quote:
Clone Trooper (9)
Hit Points: 20 (10)
Defense: 17 (13)
Attack: +7 (+6)
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Order 66

Notes: Clone Troopers needed some help in the stats department.


So you just turned them into heavy defense, +15 shooters while adjacent to Aayla? And that's just Clone Troopers. Wow.
I think when the game was designed, Clone Troopers were balanced against Battle Droids. You've done away with that concept here, IMO. I would probably reduce the CE to a +4 Attack bonus, or a +3 Attack and +3 Defense. Of course, I would also leave the defense at 13, but that's just me. Maybe if you gave Aayla Force Valor so she could be a follower in some squads.

Quote:
ARC Trooper (18)
Hit Points: 40
Defense: 18 (16)
Attack: +10
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Order 66
[Evade]
Grenades 10
[Mobile Attack]
[Opportunist]

Notes: I wanted to make these guys tougher to kill and able to put out some more damage.


Another example, this time of a character that could get up to +22 Attack. That would just be nuts.

Quote:
Captain Typho (18)
Hit Points: 60
Defense: 17
Attack: +8
Damage: 20 (10)

Special Abilities:
Unique
Bodyguard

Commander Effect:
[Non-Unique Republic allies within 6 squares gain Bodyguard.]
(Allied Naboo Soldiers gain Bodyguard.)

Notes: 10 damage shooters don't really get much play. His CE was decent, but I hate to see just one piece get boosted by a CE.


Death of theme. Sigh.

Quote:
Agen Kolar (29)
Hit Points: 120
Defense: 19
Attack: +13
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Melee Attack
[Double Attack]

Force Powers:
Force 4
Lightsaber Block
Lightsaber Deflect
[Recovery 40 (Force 1, replaces turn: Remove 40 damage from this character)] (Recovery 20)

Notes: Agen Kolar needed Double Attack. Also, Recovery 20 is a waste of a turn, so I upgraded it to Recovery 40.


I would have gone with Regeneration 40 instead. It's silly to me that it's a Force power that prevents you from moving or doing, well, anything.

Quote:
Mace Windu (63)
Hit Points: 150
Defense: 22
Attack: +16
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Melee Attack
Triple Attack
Vaapad-Style Fighting

Force Powers:
[Force 2] (Force 5)
[Force Renewal 1]
Lightsaber Block
[Lightsaber Deflect]
Lightsaber Precision
[Master of the Force 2]

Notes: This is the best follower Mace already, but he's kind of lacking for a 63 point piece. Adjusting his Force powers to a more modern set up should boost him a lot.


Windu needs the following: Greater Mobile Attack; Use the Force; Vicious Attack; Lightsaber Assault

Then he would be worth the points.

Quote:
Yoda (55)
Hit Points: 140
Defense: 22
Attack: +15
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
[Twin Attack] (Double Attack)
Flurry Attack
Melee Attack

Force Powers:
Force 3
Force Defense
[Force Renewal 2] (Force Renewal 1)
Lightsaber Reflect
Master of the Force 3

Commander Effect:
Followers within 6 squares may reroll each failed save once.

Notes: Ideally I'd decrease his cost, but that's against my rules. Instead I upped his Renewal and gave him Twin instead of Double. The extra mobility and fast attacks provided by Twin seem more Yoda-like.


Ugh. So you took away his ability to strike twice and replaced it with something where he can attack twice some of the time against enemies with more than 40 HP. Here's my suggestion:

Yoda 55 pts.
140 HP
22 Defense
+12 Attack
20 Damage

Special Abilities - Unique; Melee Attack. Momentum +4; Twin Attack; Mobile Attack; Flurry Attack

Force Powers
Force 3. Force Renewal 1; Force Defense; Force Leap; Lightsaber Assault; Lightsaber Riposte; Lightsaber Reflect; Use the Force; Master of the Force 3

Commander Effect: Followers within 6 squares can reroll saves once per turn.

Now Flurry is something to be feared. I also removed the word "failed" from his CE. It's more interesting with things like Dominate that way.

Quote:
Battle Droid (4)
Hit Points: 10
Defense: 11 (9)
Attack: +0
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Droid

Notes: I'm not sure 11 defense will be way harder to hit than 9, but it can't hurt.


Spotter 10 and 12 Defense, and these guys would be fine.

Quote:
Battle Droid Officer (9)
Hit Points: 20
Defense: 13
Attack: +0
Damage: 10

Special Abilities:
Droid
(Fire Control)

Commander Effect:
[Droids are subject to this effect: Non-Unique Droid allies get +4 Attack.]

Notes: Although it pains me to do it, I changed Fire Control into a Commander Effect.


No, no, no, and no. Just ... no. In an age of Disruptive, Fire Control is key. Give the BDO +4 Attack and leave Fire Control (since originally the BDO was supposed to have that +4 bonus, back when a character counted as its own ally). The HP could use a boost too. The ability to garner a really high attack bonus is about all the Droid faction has going for it anymore. This change takes that away from them.

Well those are my suggestions.


RE: Aayla and the Clones. I made the stats in the order they are listed. When I picked Aayla's CE, I didn't know how much I was going to boost the Clones. I agree that especially the ARC Troopers seem pretty ridiculous with that combo. Although, I'm not sure how much I can decrease Aayla's CE and still have her be effective. I think Aayla and a knot of Clones should be an effective squad design, even with the inherent weaknesses of having to stay adjacent.

RE: ARC Trooper. Probably made them a little too tough. They should be slightly weaker than Lando DS for the same cost (being non-Unique), but right now they're a little better than Lando. I'll revisit them.

RE: Captain Typho. It hurt me to kill the theme of his CE as well. I think I have an idea for how to change it to make it a little better.

RE: Agen Kolar. I agree that Recovery is not so useful because it replaces turn, but Regeneration 40 would be way too much. Ideally, I'd make it so Recovery replaces attacks, but that's creating a new ability, and I don't want to do that. I think 1 FP for Recovery 40 should be okay.

RE: Mace Windu. I think your suggestions would make Mace worth at least 80 points. I think he *should* have Lightsaber Assault though. He needs some way to get multiple attacks more often.

RE: Yoda. He's one of the most competitive pieces available from Clone Strike. I'm not sure that he needs any improvement, but it's always bothered me that the Republic Yoda's seem so slow and stationary, when in the movie he flipped out and killed people like a little green ninja. Twin Attack just seems more Yoda-like to me than Double or Triple. Adding Assault on top of that would be too much for his 55 points I think. I agree that your change to his CE would be cool, but again, it's already one of the most over-powered CEs in the game, in my opinion, and I don't want to make him too good.

RE: Battle Droid. I think giving a 4 point shooter any kind of special ability (like Spotter +10) would be overkill. I can see the argument for 12 defense.

RE: Battle Droid Officer. I think this piece is currently overpowered for 9 points. I understand how important Fire Control is to the Separatist faction as it stands today, but hopefully after I'm done with RotS 2008 and Universe 2008, they will have other things going for them besides the ability to get high attack bonuses on Droids.


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 Post subject: Re: Clone Strike 2008
PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:17 pm 
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Grand Moff Boris wrote:
Not bad overall. Once again it's power-ups across the board, which I agree CS figures needed moreso than RS, because it's so heavy melee.

I'm not a fan of replacing Double with Twin, though. They are NOT the same thing.

Just curious: did you playtest these changes? Most of them seem balanced with where the game is now, but I am wondering. (Aayla is one that springs to mind, especially since you turned Clone Troopers into powerhouses for their cost, and THEN also created a powerful CE for them.)


It's not power-ups across the board. I purposely weakened the Battle Droid Officer and Aurra Sing, and left many pieces untouched.

I agree that Double and Twin are not the same thing. I left Double (or added it) to figures I that I think were suited to it, and I changed it to Twin when I thought that was the better ability for the unit's cost.

I didn't playtest any changes. This is all just theory and fun. :)

I appreciate your comments and critiques.


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 Post subject: Re: Clone Strike 2008
PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:20 pm 
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DarkLordVerjal wrote:
All great stats, save for...

shinja wrote:
Asajj Ventress (34)
Hit Points: 100
Defense: 20
Attack: +12
Damage: 20

Special Abilities:
Unique
Double Attack
Loner
Melee Attack
[Deceptive]
[Stealth]

Force Powers:
Force 2
Lightsaber Riposte



How the heck did you NOT give her twin and double?


I hadn't thought of that... I don't think it really fits with my vision for the piece, but I'm interested in seeing your version of how she should be.


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 Post subject: Re: Clone Strike 2008
PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 12:41 pm 
Sith Infiltrator
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Your's is fine, I'd just add twin, that's out.

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Strike 2008
PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:42 pm 
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shinja wrote:
RE: Yoda. ... I'm not sure that he needs any improvement, but it's always bothered me that the Republic Yoda's seem so slow and stationary, when in the movie he flipped out and killed people like a little green ninja. Twin Attack just seems more Yoda-like to me than Double or Triple.


This is double-speak to me. Twin Attack doesn't make him more mobile or more "flip-out-and-kill," it just limits his choice of targets to 1 every single round (barring a crit for the flurry).

Greater Mobile is Rob's solution, I think, to the need to attack multiple enemies while on the move.

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 Post subject: Re: Clone Strike 2008
PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2008 3:09 pm 
Really Cool Alien from a Cantina
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Why...just why...did you remove Fire Control?

This is pretty much one of the only things that prevents the Seps from being a lamer faction...and you eliminate it?

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