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what to use with him?
Poll ended at Fri Dec 28, 2007 2:50 am
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 Post subject: Building around Luke with Yoda
PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:50 am 
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150 point squad so he's nearly half my point total. I want to try him out, but I'm not really sure how to best use him. What type of squad does he work best in?

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:27 am 
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the must piece with him is Princess Leia (AaE) + some good Han Solo (RH, Hantaun, Rogue).. i will show you 2 squads, which were 1st and 2nd (mine ;) )in Czech National Championship (bt only 16 players :-( )
1st
Loda (70)
Princess Leia (20)
HS, Rogue (30)
Rauntaun (13)
Juno Eclipse (8)
3x Uggies (9)
----- 150, 8 activations

2nd
Loda (70)
Princess Leia (20)
HS, Rogue (30)
Juno Eclipse (8)
R2D2 (8)
Bespin Guard (5)
3x Uggies (9)
---- 150, 9 activations
I lost only vs squad above, and yes, we built together. I don't play rauntaun, because i don't have it.

This squad should beat anything you could imagine - it has nice shooter, door control, disruptive, supresses enemy initiative control, and has Recon. Only problem are heavy melee hitters squads, but if rightfuly and carefuly played, not a problem at all. I definetly thinks this is a new meta squad.If anyone has any doiubts about it, try it ! - Broken Boba has no chance coz of deflect and reroll, vs B&B initiative control, Never tell me the odds, disruptive, vs meelee hitters Stun + initiative cotrol, vs new unleashed power users Cancel.. But it must be played carefuly (Loda should have at least 9-12 force points, when he goes to action)


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 7:12 am 
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I'll probably pass on Han Rogue. In my last tourny (200) I replaced Han RH with him at the last minute and he was a waste of points. I never needed NTMTO and he couldn't hit a thing he shot at. Princess Leia is an almost certain addition though. Possibly along with R2PO for door control and override.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 8:34 am 
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Han Rogue though can be used with Princess Leia for a nice easy 70 damage early in the game when you're opponent is still across the board. Han RH can't be used with Leia, although if you manage to win Init and have Han RH within 6 of Loda, that's a hefty amount of damage up front.

With both Thrawn and Revan around now, and the MTB out there, Han Rogue should be a little more useful. Of those three, in 150 points you are probably only going to face Thrawn, so that may be why Rogue won't be quite as popular.

I think overall Loda also benefits from having either a piece that can dish out ridiculous amounts of damage (Han Scoundrel), something than can play interference for Loda (Master Kota, Maris Brood, Vader's Apprentice, Obi-Wan U), or something to keep him alive longer (2-1B, Chewie RH). Loda definitely fits in an odd spot, because at 70 points you'd think he is a beatstick, but he really is still more of a support piece. It takes extra pieces (like Princess Leia) to turn Loda into a beat stick. But it is possible. Kangoor is right in that the biggest key is to make sure you about 9-12 FPs before engaging the enemy.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 9:28 am 
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I actually really like Yoke in 100. Your opponent won't have enough shooters to deplete his Force pool with, so he can Stun/Reflect/FPRR at his leisure while running around hitting people. Yoke, Hantaun, and an Ewok is one of my favorites now.

If you're running 150, I'd definately suggest using low to mid cost shooters like Han, Aurra, Lando, etc, and Leia to boost his attacks. As somebody mentioned above, I think the best strategy is to use Han + Leia and sit back and build some FPs while using Leia to Hancannon for a bit, then run Leia out with Yoke.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:14 am 
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A number of shooters that can actually hit are the way to go. Keep those activations up and spread the damage.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 10:35 am 
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Azrakel wrote:
I actually really like Yoke in 100. Your opponent won't have enough shooters to deplete his Force pool with, so he can Stun/Reflect/FPRR at his leisure while running around hitting people. Yoke, Hantaun, and an Ewok is one of my favorites now.


The only real problem with this squad in the 100 point game is Bane. Using Luke & Yoda's Force Defense to stop Bane's Sith Rage will only last so long. And Bane only need 4 attacks without Rage to kill L&Y. L&Y needs 10 attacks. So that means in one round, Bane will base you from 8-10 squares away and attack once. Next round, he'll Double while you twin, third round, L&Y are dead. At MOST you've done 120 dmg to him by this point. Oh, and Hantaun dies in 1, maybe 2 rounds to Bane as well.

Luke and Yoda is a GREAT piece against shooters, but against melee you REALLY have to play carefully.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 12:35 pm 
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LoboStele wrote:
Han Rogue part...

I think overall Loda also benefits from having either a piece that can dish out ridiculous amounts of damage (Han Scoundrel), something than can play interference for Loda (Master Kota, Maris Brood, Vader's Apprentice, Obi-Wan U), or something to keep him alive longer (2-1B, Chewie RH). Loda definitely fits in an odd spot, because at 70 points you'd think he is a beatstick, but he really is still more of a support piece. It takes extra pieces (like Princess Leia) to turn Loda into a beat stick. But it is possible. Kangoor is right in that the biggest key is to make sure you about 9-12 FPs before engaging the enemy.


I'm not really worried about iniative control. On that 200 point squad i mentioned I gave in and used Rogue then primarialy because i was worried about Revan. He's less of a fear in a lower point game. Hardly anybody else where I play even has Thrawn so I'm not too worried about him either. MTB I'm willing to face and then try to play a hit and run style while taking out as much of the MTB's fodder as I can.

I wasn't thinking of him as a beatstick. More as a defensive tank type piece that would hopefully be able to use its abilites to stay alive long enough for his support to whittle down the opponents squad. That was the idea behind my iniatial build idea of Loda with lower point shooters like Lando DS.

The other idea I liked was pairing him with Obi Unleashed. Then I could have Obi rush in and hopefully lay in some damage before dropping and giving Loda a fp boost. I'd only have 36 points left to go with them, but that's still enough for a couple useful lower cost pieces like Rauntaun, Juno, R2.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 12:54 pm 
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LoboStele wrote:
The only real problem with this squad in the 100 point game is Bane. Using Luke & Yoda's Force Defense to stop Bane's Sith Rage will only last so long. And Bane only need 4 attacks without Rage to kill L&Y. L&Y needs 10 attacks. So that means in one round, Bane will base you from 8-10 squares away and attack once. Next round, he'll Double while you twin, third round, L&Y are dead. At MOST you've done 120 dmg to him by this point. Oh, and Hantaun dies in 1, maybe 2 rounds to Bane as well.

Luke and Yoda is a GREAT piece against shooters, but against melee you REALLY have to play carefully.


Are you so sure? If Loda wins init, Bane likely wont even get to attack. Assuming Loda has Princess Leia, he needs 3 rounds to kill Bane, not 4 (2 if Leia hits Bane once herself).

Also, why would Loda let Bane base him from 8-10 for an attack? Loda can move 12 and twin, so why on earth would that happen other than if Bane moved last then followed with an init win. However, I would expect better counting out of Loda. Especially since he wants to gain fps and would not want to be based early.

Remember, MotF wont help Bane if Loda has enough fps to burn. (Stun - Force Defense any rerolls). Pretty much one Stun should end it actually in Loda's favor.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 1:18 pm 
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Good point...I forgot about pairing Loda with Leia in 100 point games. That would definitely turn it in Luke's favor. And I also keep forgetting about Force Stun. Loda winning init would really put a wrench in Bane's plans. Although, with average rolling, the Bane player should be able to make his saves.

Plus, I was responding specifically to the Loda/Hantaun build, which I believe is inferior to the Loda/Leia build, now that I think about it.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 1:49 pm 
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LoboStele wrote:
Although, with average rolling, the Bane player should be able to make his saves.


He has to make 3 50% chance saves to not be stunned, without the use of fps until the third. I have no idea what the percentage of failure vs success is given those circumstances, but its certainly much less than 50%. This is of course assuming Loda has 5 or more fps when they win init - and need not spend those to move.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 18, 2007 2:23 pm 
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The chance of making the first stun save: 50%. The chance at making the 2nd stun save: 50%. The chance at making both of those is a certainly below 50%, but once you reach that 3rd stun, then L&Y have used their 3 force uses/turn, and now Bane would have 3 chances at rolling on the last one. So, the odds of Bane saving on the last one are pretty good. Overall, I think the math adds up to 25% chance of success on one of the first two, with a 87.5% chance of success on the third stun.

I guess, with average rolling, the Bane player might make his first save, then fail the 2nd one, and L&Y could Force Defense the re-roll, and that would put a hamper in Bane's output pretty easily. But L&Y would have to be careful with that, as I don't think it would be too hard for Bane to wear down those Force Points pretty quickly.

Come to think of it....why wouldn't the Bane player just give up the AoO and move to attack Leia?

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