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 Post subject: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Wed Jun 23, 2010 1:33 pm 
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I put this together with local tournaments in mind. I'm not too sure the Fringe filler is as good as it could be, so any suggestions would be appreciated.

http://www.bloomilk.com/Squads/View.aspx?ID=87206

--Deceptive Trap--

45 Garm Bel Iblis
52 Yuuzhan Vong Ossus Guardian x2
25 Han Solo in Stormtrooper Armor
25 Jaina Solo
22 Corellian Security Officer
9 General Dodonna
8 Wicket
5 Caamasi Noble
6 Mouse Droid x2
3 Ugnaught Demolitionist

Preferred Reinforcements:
(Garm Bel Iblis) 16 Elite Rebel Commando
(Garm Bel Iblis) 11 Ithorian Commander

(200pts. 14 activations)

Camasi/Wicket for the traps to assist Han for a barrage, and help the other shooters in the back.
Ossus Guards can do 60/80 (activated) from 12 away against Jedi. (Djem So could be bad here...)
Garm's CE only helps Jaina (very little at that), but I needed him to get the IC. Scrub killer.
(I thought about a Bothan for a follow-up twin from the Vong, but needed the override.)

I'm not very comfortable with door control as is, so could drop something for more Uggs/Mice etc.

Any thoughts?
Map suggestions?


Last edited by swinefeld on Wed Jun 23, 2010 2:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Wed Jun 23, 2010 1:53 pm 
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My suggestion would be to take out the Camaasi and add another ugnaught. You are bringing in an override piece with stealth, so two uggies plus that is probably enough. Or you could pull out Wicket (the Ithorian will give you a decent attack bonus for the Vong) put in an R7 and then you could bring a Bothan NOble with Garm.

As for switching out a Guardian for a JH, I don't think you can do that as the Vong JH does not have affinity for NR.

On a separate note, you could take the Corellian Security guy, Wicket, and the Camaasi and fit in Jarael who would benefit from both Garm and the Ithorian, an R-7 and an uggy and bring in a Bothan Noble with Garm.

As for map, I would suggest either Ravaged Base or Throne Room.

Hope this helps


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 Post subject: Re: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Wed Jun 23, 2010 2:23 pm 
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wampafang wrote:
My suggestion would be to take out the Camaasi and add another ugnaught. You are bringing in an override piece with stealth, so two uggies plus that is probably enough. Or you could pull out Wicket (the Ithorian will give you a decent attack bonus for the Vong) put in an R7 and then you could bring a Bothan NOble with Garm.

As for switching out a Guardian for a JH, I don't think you can do that as the Vong JH does not have affinity for NR.

On a separate note, you could take the Corellian Security guy, Wicket, and the Camaasi and fit in Jarael who would benefit from both Garm and the Ithorian, an R-7 and an uggy and bring in a Bothan Noble with Garm.

As for map, I would suggest either Ravaged Base or Throne Room.

Hope this helps


Thanks very much for the suggestions, and for noting the obvious oversight about the JH, duh. :P

Jarael could be fun here. I will tinker a bit...

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 Post subject: Re: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Wed Jun 23, 2010 9:15 pm 
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I agree that the corsec officer is not needed and would replace him with jareal for sure. And r7 over wicket is a better choice IMO as well.

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 Post subject: Re: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Wed Jun 23, 2010 10:17 pm 
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sthlrd2 wrote:
I agree that the corsec officer is not needed and would replace him with jareal for sure. And r7 over wicket is a better choice IMO as well.

Well, Wicket usually doesn't last long, so can't argue much with that. :P

No doubt Jarael is great with the Ithorian, and pseudo-GMA moving 4 is not too shabby. The Corsec could go, but I'd like to really pump up the Ossus, and with Dodonna and 14 acts (and maybe a decent barrage from Han), I should be able to hold them back until they can pummel something pretty hard - especially force users. I do like the Camasi getting Its a Trap and then Wicket helping Han. There are definitely several other directions it could go, so I'll see what the points will allow once I have a better door control plan. Some nice food for thought.

Thanks for the suggestions, I will test them out. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Thu Jun 24, 2010 9:40 am 
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I like the idea of using the CorSec to pump up an Ithorian swarm. This squad has Han STA, Wicket, and Ithorian Commander, and a bunch of points devoted to the 10 damage melee attackers... so it's a lot like a swarm build, except it's got 2 YVOG's instead of the traditional 7-10 Aqualish Assassins.

It's kind of a different squad concept, but what about using Garm to bring the CorSec into a Rebel squad, rather than using Garm to bring the IC into an NR squad? It would mean your swarm is more traditional, but I like the synergy of CorSec + AA's, this may be stronger than Corsec + YVOG, and you can replace Jaina with more swarm characters.


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 Post subject: Re: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Thu Jun 24, 2010 11:09 am 
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barzillai wrote:
I like the idea of using the CorSec to pump up an Ithorian swarm. This squad has Han STA, Wicket, and Ithorian Commander, and a bunch of points devoted to the 10 damage melee attackers... so it's a lot like a swarm build, except it's got 2 YVOG's instead of the traditional 7-10 Aqualish Assassins.

It's kind of a different squad concept, but what about using Garm to bring the CorSec into a Rebel squad, rather than using Garm to bring the IC into an NR squad? It would mean your swarm is more traditional, but I like the synergy of CorSec + AA's, this may be stronger than Corsec + YVOG, and you can replace Jaina with more swarm characters.

It is a different squad concept, but certainly worth exploring. A whole slew of other options with the Rebs.

The YVOGs can provide a very deadly counter to Yodabuck, whereas the AAs are toast in most cases. In either case, positioning is going to make or break the squad I reckon.

Thanks a lot for your input. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 8:29 am 
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Definitely Jarael over the CorSec guy. Just the threat of the triple activaton can make for your opponent rethink their placement before the end of the round.

I think Id drop Wicket too, but thats just me.

Id like to see you play this some night. It looks like a good bit of fun.

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Also t4 for override and a cheeky flame.


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 Post subject: Re: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 12:03 pm 
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Disturbed1 wrote:
Definitely Jarael over the CorSec guy. Just the threat of the triple activaton can make for your opponent rethink their placement before the end of the round.

I think Id drop Wicket too, but thats just me.

Id like to see you play this some night. It looks like a good bit of fun.

Well, Wicket/Camasi are in there not just to help Han on a FA (not barrage, lol), but also so ERC/Garm/Dodonna/Corsec can pick off fodder or target a -Stealth piece. Not to mention the Camasi can kill activated fodder with a lucky roll. But as usual, Wicket will have a bullseye on him...

Having Jarael activating things synergizes nicely with the Corsec. So then maybe I forgo the whole Han/Jaina thing for her and another YVOG, or TBSV + R7 or uggs/mice. Approach carefully with the YVOGs rather than charge. If my door control in the main squad is OK, then I could go with a Bothan Noble over the ERC, which will make most beatsticks very nervous. :twisted:

I could also drop Han/Jaina/Corsec/Wicket/Camasi for Leia/Wedge/Jarael/R7/ugg/md. And rename the squad. :cry:

I would definitely like to play this as-is sometime, just to see which of all these suggestions would have helped the most. :P

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 Post subject: Re: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 12:18 pm 
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I think there is too much tech. I think you have to go Han or Garm.

For the build like everyone said. I would drop the Cor for Jarael.
O ERC and one uggie is not enough for door control. You need to play at least 4 uggies hehehe.
I think 2 and ERC if needed. I might even go just one uggie yay yay and wicket for r7. That gives you more of a chance to bring in the bothan since i feel your damage is lite.


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 Post subject: Re: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 12:34 pm 
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What about this?

--Deceptive Traps testing--
45 Garm Bel Iblis
28 Dash Rendar, Renegade Smuggler
52 Yuuzhan Vong Ossus Guardian x2
23 Jarael
22 Corellian Security Officer
10 Jagged Fel
9 General Dodonna
8 R7 Astromech Droid
3 Mouse Droid

Preferred Reinforcements:
(Garm Bel Iblis) 16 Elite Rebel Commando
(Garm Bel Iblis) 11 Ithorian Commander

(200pts. 12 activations)

You have two override pieces, which would hopefully suffice for door control. You advance carefully with the Vong and Jarael, all of whom get Deceptive and Its a Trap from the CorSec, giving them more dmg output vs activated opponents, and making stealth figs able to be seen so Dash (shooting at +14 for 30, thanks to Jag and CorSec) can provide late round cover fire.

If you think you need more activations or or uggies/ mice you could drop Jag and the R7 for Wicket (to get Dash's attack back to 14 with Opp) and 3 mice/uggs.

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Also t4 for override and a cheeky flame.


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 Post subject: Re: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 1:45 pm 
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Disturbed1 wrote:
What about this?

--Deceptive Traps testing--
<snip squad>

You have two override pieces, which would hopefully suffice for door control. You advance carefully with the Vong and Jarael, all of whom get Deceptive and Its a Trap from the CorSec, giving them more dmg output vs activated opponents, and making stealth figs able to be seen so Dash (shooting at +14 for 30, thanks to Jag and CorSec) can provide late round cover fire.

If you think you need more activations or or uggies/ mice you could drop Jag and the R7 for Wicket (to get Dash's attack back to 14 with Opp) and 3 mice/uggs.


Thanks, but unfortunately, the fact that the 22pt Corsec only helps non-unique allies is surely the reason he is seldom used. I do like the Dash/Jag idea (or other good shooter - old man Han?) and will explore that in a sans-Corsec build.


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 Post subject: Re: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 1:47 pm 
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jonnyb815 wrote:
I think there is too much tech. I think you have to go Han or Garm.

For the build like everyone said. I would drop the Cor for Jarael.
O ERC and one uggie is not enough for door control. You need to play at least 4 uggies hehehe.
I think 2 and ERC if needed. I might even go just one uggie yay yay and wicket for r7. That gives you more of a chance to bring in the bothan since i feel your damage is lite.


Yeah, it is a bit too techy. Disruptive majorly hoses this, but no way around that.
Losing Han/Jaina/Wicket seems to be the way to go. No point in charging into disruptive range just to lose all bonuses.
I can get Jarael/TBSV/R7x2 and bring the Bothan instead of ERC.

I hear what everyone is saying about the Corsec, but I built the whole squad around using the poor neglected guy. :P

That said, the discussion thus far has been really helpful, and I'm working on making another build that doesn't involve the Corsec and can hopefully fit in some decent shooter support. (along the lines of disturbed1's Dash/Jag idea)
I'll post the results when I have the two ideas sorted out.

Thanks everyone 8-)


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 Post subject: Re: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 10:05 pm 
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I'd also consider bringing in a reberl commando pathfinder, as he can really help your Guardains get up and into the battle.


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 Post subject: Re: Deceptive Trap
PostPosted: Fri Jun 25, 2010 10:33 pm 
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Ask 127 wrote:
I'd also consider bringing in a reberl commando pathfinder, as he can really help your Guardains get up and into the battle.

That could come in rather handy on Ruined Base and some other maps. Gotta love reinforcements. 8-)
Thanks

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