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 Post subject: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 2:23 am 
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Tossing the Skywalker

115 Grand master Luke skywalker
29 Ganner Rhysode
24 Talon Karrde
15 Lobot, CLO
9 Dodonna
6 uggie demos x2
198
7 acts.

This was the squad I was really wanting to use at regionals but some how forgot my card for Karrde lol

anyway before i found out I could have borrowed the card I had already registered my black and blue build.

Anyway Ganner has a good shot to move in closer with his stealth against most builds and just pick up GM Luke and toss him where ever he needs to be. Dodonna helps a little with activations but not a whole lot.

GM Luke has some beef to keep himself alive for a round or 2 after being put directly in the mix. Plus after Luke is tossed adjacent to something he is either going to kill it or make sure to get AOO against everything but the lancer, Luke speeder, or boba if they are not killed outright beforehand. On a side note Master Skywalker is able to move 12 with master speed after being tossed 12 squares and still get a twin for a total of 24 squares of movement. this is enough to get into the commander area of opponent if needed.

Talon gives a couple of rounds of disruptive while you move the squad into position so takes a little bit away from Lancer and Yobuck squads not to mention swap squads. Yep your pretty much moving this squad forward together.

Lobot for some door control not to mention reserves that may be needed which can add up if Karrde stays alive and both hit at same time.

Uggies just to get rid of as many door s as they can before they die. They don't add much to the acts and other then getting rid of those doors as fast as they can no real reason for me to have them in this squad.

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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 7:41 am 
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I think its as close an optimal Luke build as you are going to get. I was thinking of something very similar, but wasnt sure how it would work. I agree that Luke Ganner Talon are musts, but i wasnt sure how to finish it. Im not sure i like Lobot. I think i might go R7 for more HP and more activations, but having a redundant recon could be useful. I am very tempted to run it for our regional. I just dont like having all those points tied up in Luke. If he goes down it is almost a guaranteed loss even if he wipes out over half the team before he goes down.

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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 8:41 am 
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I saw someone run a grandmaster Luke, ganner at my regional. He had a full hitpoint Luke get pushed into a pit and fail 3 saves to kill him. It was bad but at the same time a little funny, for as tough as Luke could be somtimes he just goes down really fast.

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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 12:27 pm 
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115 Grand master Luke skywalker
29 Ganner Rhysode
24 Talon Karrde
8 R7 Astromech Droid
9 Dodonna
6 uggie demos x5
200
10 acts.


The above adjustments are bolded. I recommend going with more activations. You don't necessarily need 5 ugnaughts (you can use MD's as well. They make great shields and are not affected by some abilities due to them being droids).

Be careful of Djem So Style on minis that have a solid attack (Vaders/other Lukes/General Skywalkers). If two Djem So fighters start hitting each other, they CAN'T stop until they miss their Djem So saves, and when GMLS has a twin attack, and a 19 attack, you can bet both fighters will be dead long before the Djem So attacks finish (which means you are likely going to exchange a 115 point mini for a 47 to 75 point mini).


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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 12:33 pm 
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thats not right about Djem so you have to make the djem save but not the attack roll so you can end the fight whenever you want or you dont even have to djem so back if they do. You just have to make the save but not the attack roll. I dont understand why you need tempo control once your in your goign to be doing 2 so turn 1-2 are the only times acts will matter. You need another beat yeah I dont think Distruptive in Talon is better over a second attacker. Luke just gets shot to death by Rex Dash or Cad. Ill trade my GMA attacker to trap you. Luke is just not tier 1-2 he just costs to much he might be fun to play which all you care about but i think a second attacker is needed no matter what.


Last edited by jonnyb815 on Wed May 12, 2010 12:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 12:34 pm 
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You don't have to make the Djem So attack if you don't want to.

It always makes me laugh aloud when I read comments about the lightsaber forms as though the save will always be 11+. What kind of dice are you guys using? :P

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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 12:39 pm 
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I should of added that. It is kind of funny.


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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 12:43 pm 
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jonnyb815 wrote:
Luke is just not tier 1-2 he just costs to much he might be fun to play which all you care about


While not Tier 1, I think GMLS can be competitive at least at the Regional level. With Ganner now in the mix for NR, GMLS becomes a scary threat to be reckoned with. One of the Finalists at the PA-MD Regional had a GMLS squad, and if it were not for missing practically all of his saves in the first Playoff match, he would have made it to the Final, and who knows what would've happened then?

I just balk at when people say a particular figure is not a "Tier 1" character. With the right support, a lot of lower-rated figures can be great. Didn't I hear something about a Nute Gunray squad being 1 mistake away from winning a Regional? ;)


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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 1:13 pm 
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Your right I am wrong GMLS is the best mini ever.


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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 1:45 pm 
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Well, seems to me that Nute just does for the Seps (less override) what Lobot does for most squads. He's a (clever) strategic piece, not the win/lose damage dealer that Luke has to be. Apples and oranges for sure. :)

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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 2:28 pm 
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Sithdragon13 wrote:
I think its as close an optimal Luke build as you are going to get. I was thinking of something very similar, but wasnt sure how it would work. I agree that Luke Ganner Talon are musts, but i wasnt sure how to finish it. Im not sure i like Lobot. I think i might go R7 for more HP and more activations, but having a redundant recon could be useful. I am very tempted to run it for our regional. I just dont like having all those points tied up in Luke. If he goes down it is almost a guaranteed loss even if he wipes out over half the team before he goes down.


It was toss up on lobot but with the restricted map list i felt I would need at least one override and the low acts kinda forcing me into gambling on the 5% shot at reserves.


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You need another beat yeah I dont think Distruptive in Talon is better over a second attacker.


Well jonny I may need another beat but I'm thinking disruptive is going to be key for this build in first 2 rounds. After that I agree completely. If played right you can probably get rid of one of the opponents beats first then only have to deal with 1-3 left. lol and you will still have luke and ganner as your beats.

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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 2:29 pm 
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jonnyb815 wrote:
Your right I am wrong GMLS is the best mini ever.


Its about time you come around to my way of thinking lol

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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Wed May 12, 2010 9:28 pm 
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This squad could probably beat my twin lancer squad but I don't think it could beat Tim's single Lancer and would have major trouble against any thrawn/cad bacne squads as you just run out of force too fast.

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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2010 5:38 am 
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urbanjedi wrote:
This squad could probably beat my twin lancer squad but I don't think it could beat Tim's single Lancer and would have major trouble against any thrawn/cad bacne squads as you just run out of force too fast.

Except that with the throw, Luke can reach the core of your squad in a single turn. While i agree that multi shooters like Bane are one of Luke's weaknesses, with the throw, Cad/Thrawn can go down fast. Luke can cross the entire board by turn two. It might be a tougher fight than you think.

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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2010 7:51 am 
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jonnyb815 wrote:
thats not right about Djem so you have to make the djem save but not the attack roll so you can end the fight whenever you want or you dont even have to djem so back if they do. You just have to make the save but not the attack roll.


I'm glad that is the case actually. A long time ago, I read posts (two different posts at two different times....I think one was at wizards, and one was elsewhere) and both the posts emphasized that you had to make the djem so saves, and that you HAD to make an attack if you made the save. That was a rule I actually did not like. I'm relieved to know that was incorrect.

Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2010 8:17 am 
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Sithdragon13 wrote:
urbanjedi wrote:
This squad could probably beat my twin lancer squad but I don't think it could beat Tim's single Lancer and would have major trouble against any thrawn/cad bacne squads as you just run out of force too fast.

Except that with the throw, Luke can reach the core of your squad in a single turn. While i agree that multi shooters like Bane are one of Luke's weaknesses, with the throw, Cad/Thrawn can go down fast. Luke can cross the entire board by turn two. It might be a tougher fight than you think.


I agree, Luke can cause a lot of trouble for Imps if Cad is the main damage dealer. That's why the best IMP squads with him, will be running Vader Scourge as the beat. Vader with Opp and JH is quite the match for Luke. I did the odds for someone a year ago on WotC showing how likely it was that Vader takes him down, and if I remember correctly, it was something like 70% of the time. The remaining 30% Luke would still be so beat up that he would be an easy match for Cad to finish off in the hands of a decent player. Now, Luke is a tank, and the odd dice rolls here and there could allow him to survive and pull out a rare win in this case, but that doesn't mean much to me :)

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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2010 8:22 am 
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urbanjedi wrote:
This squad could probably beat my twin lancer squad but I don't think it could beat Tim's single Lancer and would have major trouble against any thrawn/cad bacne squads as you just run out of force too fast.


At least your squad has an IG-86 - which would help. You could Lance with both of them (sacrificially) and take 80 off Luke, and I think Sidious/Grievous/IG-86 could finish him off. Lack of override hurts here.

My single Lancer would only win if I can lance his override and lock doors. Then I can slowly wear him down, and keep him locked out. It's still a tough match-up. Often a 2 point win.


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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2010 8:28 am 
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TimmerB123 wrote:
urbanjedi wrote:
This squad could probably beat my twin lancer squad but I don't think it could beat Tim's single Lancer and would have major trouble against any thrawn/cad bacne squads as you just run out of force too fast.


At least your squad has an IG-86 - which would help. You could Lance with both of them (sacrificially) and take 80 off Luke, and I think Sidious/Grievous/IG-86 could finish him off. Lack of override hurts here.

My single Lancer would only win if I can lance his override and lock doors. Then I can slowly wear him down, and keep him locked out. It's still a tough match-up. Often a 2 point win.


Remember, Luke still has MotF2 and block, so odds are he beats either of your lancer squads in most cases. As you said, the best chance either of you have is going for the 2 point win by isolating Luke, trading your Lancers for his support and trying to lock him away from the rest of your squad. But that's just part of the meta right now. Every squad has their "banes". Its just a matter of guessing which ones you are more likely to face in a given tournament.

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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2010 9:46 am 
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billiv15 wrote:
TimmerB123 wrote:
urbanjedi wrote:
This squad could probably beat my twin lancer squad but I don't think it could beat Tim's single Lancer and would have major trouble against any thrawn/cad bacne squads as you just run out of force too fast.


At least your squad has an IG-86 - which would help. You could Lance with both of them (sacrificially) and take 80 off Luke, and I think Sidious/Grievous/IG-86 could finish him off. Lack of override hurts here.

My single Lancer would only win if I can lance his override and lock doors. Then I can slowly wear him down, and keep him locked out. It's still a tough match-up. Often a 2 point win.


Remember, Luke still has MotF2 and block, so odds are he beats either of your lancer squads in most cases. As you said, the best chance either of you have is going for the 2 point win by isolating Luke, trading your Lancers for his support and trying to lock him away from the rest of your squad. But that's just part of the meta right now. Every squad has their "banes". Its just a matter of guessing which ones you are more likely to face in a given tournament.

You're right (block) - you'd be lucky to take 40 off.

Agreed about the "banes". A lot of Rock/Paper/Scissors at the moment. A bad match-up can change alot. Very few undefeated regional champs so far.


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 Post subject: Re: tossing the skywalker
PostPosted: Thu May 13, 2010 10:37 pm 
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You would actually even be lucky to take off 20 with a strafe. Remember that Djem-so Mastery lets him do 50 to the lancer (needing 2s) because of twin so the lancer doesn't even get its twin when strafing Luke if he hits 1 of 3 chances at Djem-so.

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