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 Post subject: Ridin Dirty (Lets try this again) XD
PostPosted: Mon Apr 16, 2012 2:15 pm 
Black Sun Thug
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Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2012 2:11 am
Posts: 61
GAT 37
Tyber Zann 31
General Weir 28
Admiral Piett 20
Admiral Ozzel 11
Scout Trooper on Speeder Bike 21
Storm Commando 17
Lobot 27
Mas 8

This is a PILE of fun lol Feedback Please...I expect Tim to get in on this one XD lol

@Boris i DID answer back defending my squad didnt you read the last couple threads about Tyber and such? lol gosh XD


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 Post subject: Re: Ridin Dirty (Lets try this again) XD
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 8:04 am 
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Tim has a new update to his squad, Thanx to me turning his attention to a certain piece that makes his speeders that much better. I'll let him spill the beans if he so desires as to not spoil his fun.

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 Post subject: Re: Ridin Dirty (Lets try this again) XD
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:26 am 
Imperial Dignitaries
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sthlrd2 wrote:
Tim has a new update to his squad, Thanx to me turning his attention to a certain piece that makes his speeders that much better. I'll let him spill the beans if he so desires as to not spoil his fun.

Storm Trooper Commander? +10 dmg on every attack is a HUGE bonus, when you're strafing and twinning everything.

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 Post subject: Re: Ridin Dirty (Lets try this again) XD
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:35 am 
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I was thinking Gary, but he doesn't really make sense with Ozzel, unless it's a strafe last, auto-win init and then immediately strafe back out thing. Hmm...


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 Post subject: Re: Ridin Dirty (Lets try this again) XD
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:46 am 
Imperial Dignitaries
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swinefeld wrote:
I was thinking Gary, but he doesn't really make sense with Ozzel, unless it's a strafe last, auto-win init and then immediately strafe back out thing. Hmm...

Gary would be good...but the STC would give the damage bonus at the end of the first round, as well as at the beginning of the second round...he can also give his dmg bonus to the Storm Commando, which will really ramp up that piece's dmg output when he shoots 4x.

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 Post subject: Re: Ridin Dirty (Lets try this again) XD
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 9:54 am 
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GARY is actually an addition I've considered while building my own version of Tim's squad (since I'll have to be playing a Scout Trooper on Speederbike at a Regional now...). He gives Cunning to Weir as well as the Scout Trooper, which is nice, and swinefeld's right that it can work well if you're planning on really taking advantage of Master Tactician and getting a really good strafe at the top of the round. If you can outactivate, you get the Speeder into position at the end of the round, win init, then activate it and deal pretty heavy damage.

The Stormtrooper Commander is a really interesting thought too, though, since he can boost the Storm Commando as well as the Speeder.

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 Post subject: Re: Ridin Dirty (Lets try this again) XD
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:02 am 
Master of the Order
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It actually has a lot of threats, but I think I would go one way or another. Drop Tyber and concentrate on Weir's CE (by adding another Speeder or Storm Commando) or go commander cannons by adding Imp Gov Tarkin and have Tyber and Weir able to do 120 damage each. And if you're doing that you might as well switch GAT to Mithrawn, throw in Pellaeon, leave out Piett, etc.

As is, with Lobot and Tyber you get get up to 18 activations. But that's if you only put in basic fodder.

The problem with 1 speeder is you really have to bring in a Hellion on Swoop to make it sing. You need another medium base to swap, and the swoop is the cheapest (and luckily, the best) option. You will have a really hard time using strafe without a speedy flying swapper. Even when I run 2 speeders I still like a swoop along too. As soon as you're down to 1 medium base everything is harder, especially since your big punch is with opportunist, which is the END of the round.

I also like to put in a speedy medium for swapping. Amanin Scouts rule, as they have stealth, 40hp, wheel form AND wall climber. Heck they can hit for 20 to boot! Also don't overlook a Massif as a reinforcement. 10 points brings a speed 8, 40 hp nasty little fighter (Shoulda probably been savage, but for some reason it's not). And then there is always Mynocks (also probably shoulda been savage).

But long story short, once you put in those key components, you're looking at a 12-14 activation squad, close to being dangerously low in my opinion when running Ozzel.

To make it work right you need to out-activate by at least 2 (3 vs Master tactician). You have to be able to have them activated out, then move the swoop, swap, and strafe. Otherwise Ozzel is hurting you.

The other thing I will say about Weir squads is this - they are not easy to run. Especially with speeders.

It's similar to lancers last year. Graham and I had much success running lancers with Whorm last year. Many others tried and failed. It's a squad type that takes patience, skill and extreme caution.

I haven't seen anyone else figure out how to run Scout troopers on Speeders well yet. I'm kinda surprised that nobody else has. It has great components for every situation. Speeders are wonderful activation killers, and they can hit really hard when juiced up (120 damage to a single target can't be looked down on). They can get boosted in so many ways, and with Mas those boosts become unlimited range. The fact that you can swap in and out in a faction that already has Master Tactician AND Ysalamiri gives you counters to almost anything you encounter. The fact that Commandos and Weir himself are cannons just makes it a bonus. Yes, ABM will be annoying, but you do have Ysalamiri which helps. Yes disruptive is annoying, but you have guns - you can stand back and shoot. That also gets you around reposte and Djem So. Yes Jedi (and force attuned) reflexes is something you'll have to work around (once again, you have a gun - SHOOT!) And remember you have incredible distance, so fly around that Corran Horn JM in the middle and tear up the rest of the squad. Bodyguarded distractions are mildly annoying, but really only lessen the blows in very few cases. Here's my advice - hit the bodyguard first. Fly around to the back and jack the bodyguard with your twin 30 damage (needing anything but a 1 to kill that Gammorean bodyguard) and then mow down the rest. Sure you'll only get 1 attack on the distractor, but if it lands that kills salacious, and if it's Figrin D'an then then your next pass you can kill him, or fly on by then shoot with the twin for your regular attack and hope he misses one of the 2 evades.

Anyway - the worst matchup for a Speeder squad is actually a lancer squad. Jason K's Double Lancer would mop the floor with it. Really any sidious/lancer squad squashes it. Not afraid of a republic squad without Yodabuck, but classic Skybuck is pretty much doom for you. A really stout disruptive + Jedi Reflexes squad (such as Daniel's Corran JM, KC, R2-PO GH, Ganner pilot squad) would be a great challenge. I think vs OR (specifically vs ABM) you can win. They would have to pop ABM right away first round or not advance. Either is a win for you. If they don't pop it right away then you can wait it out (they can only do it 2 or three times a game max usually). If they don't advance - same story, wait it out. Take what they give you. Go get that safe gambit and let them play from behind. Don't forget Weir has twin at +14 for 30 each hit at the end of the round without any CEs, so that can hit something important. With (usually) no movement breakers and no accurate shot, it's pretty easy to protect stealthy Weir.

There have been thorough discussions about Weir boosted Speeders, and it's clear that there have been even more off of the boards. It's very entertaining that it seems to have caused such a ripple, and it's even more entertaining that most people (even some of the best players around) can't figure it out. Is it the best squad type out there? No. Can it compete with anything? I say yes. Similar to the lancer last year - hard to run, very hard to master. Can hang with anything and is ridiculously lopsided in your favor in other matches. I have virtually no fear of sith without Revan, or Republic without Yodabuck. I have great confidence vs Mandos, vong, rebels, and separatists that I out-activate. OR (due to ABM) and NR (due to disruptive and Never Tell Me the Odds) are tricky, but win-able.

I've just been having fun with Speeders and think they are very strong. I definitely am gonna mix it up and play some other stuff too.

Can't wait to see how Daniel does with his Speeder


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 Post subject: Re: Ridin Dirty (Lets try this again) XD
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:07 am 
Master of the Order
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thereisnotry wrote:
sthlrd2 wrote:
Tim has a new update to his squad, Thanx to me turning his attention to a certain piece that makes his speeders that much better. I'll let him spill the beans if he so desires as to not spoil his fun.

Storm Trooper Commander? +10 dmg on every attack is a HUGE bonus, when you're strafing and twinning everything.


Hadn't thought of this one. That's great - it puts it into Yodabuck killing range


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 Post subject: Re: Ridin Dirty (Lets try this again) XD
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:11 am 
Master of the Order
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swinefeld wrote:
I was thinking Gary, but he doesn't really make sense with Ozzel, unless it's a strafe last, auto-win init and then immediately strafe back out thing. Hmm...


LOL, I just realized that every reference I ever heard of "GARY" I interpreted wrong. I always thought GARY was the name of the actual Security Officer Stormtrooper that let the droids by in A New Hope. I thought this was from the Robot Chicken where they flesh out his story. I am such a moron!

It wasn't until this thread when I was like, "How the heck is the Security Officer Stormtrooper helping a speeder!?!" When it dawned on me that all along GARY meant Grand Admiral Rulf Yage. That is hilarious.

Yeah - completely overlooked that piece.


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 Post subject: Re: Ridin Dirty (Lets try this again) XD
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 3:28 pm 
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GARY is a fun one. I built another squad based around the fact that he and Jaq both have Sith affinity. It's fragile as all get-out, and vulnerable to all sorts of stuff that gets run, but Jaq boosted by GARY, Klatoonian Capt, and Exar Ghost, with Revan swap to get him into spots to do damage, is not without his charms.


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 Post subject: Re: Ridin Dirty (Lets try this again) XD
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:06 pm 
Black Sun Thug
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Soo the general consensus is to drop Tyber? i had a version where i DID use tarkin with weir and tyber but got VERY chances to use the extra attacks well...needed to move alot to get shots most the time


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 Post subject: Re: Ridin Dirty (Lets try this again) XD
PostPosted: Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:26 pm 
Black Sun Thug
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OK i have revised the squad a bit:

GAT 37
General Weir 28
GARY 16
Piett 20
Ozzel 11
Speeder 21
Swoop 10
Storm Commando 17
Lobot 27
Mas 8
Salacious Crumb 5

200pts 11 acts

Hows this?


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